Need an opinion on the guitars

Vanan · #1 (**permalink**) 10-15-2009, 01:42 AM

Posted a previous version of this song without bass and the guitars sounded hollow and thin. Just recorded a quick bass track to see how it lends to the rhythm guitars with this version. So far still not quite satisfied. Hoping to "save" the rhythm tracks without having to re-record. I left out the bass at 2:38 so you guys could a/b it to see if the bass is doing anything for the guitar tone. Long story short, to re-record or tweak it to near perfection?

P.S. Guitars were recorded via an amp miked with an SM57 in a closet (Mistake #1). Recorded with some minor compression and eq.

Vanan · #2 (**permalink**) 10-15-2009, 03:21 AM

Boosted a bit on the 500K's and a lil at 100K for the hard panned rhythm guitars. Increased the level on the centre/mono "thickener" guitar (no eq treatment). This is what I ended up with. A little more pleasing to the ears. Now I can finally rest my ears and call it a night.

Let me know what you guys think about the rhythm tone this time.

garww · #3 (**permalink**) 10-15-2009, 03:45 AM

This is really just what I like !! I'm on my new fones and I think the bass is shy.

My ears are not so good, but the highs are right where I like them. I might fill out the guitars a bit, but that is taste and how the whole mix goes together.

I really like it !! This is my kind of sound - well my chords would be dated, but this is it !!

I can't be a real help because my right ear is real bad up the middle. Switching earpieces, it sounds good to me - really.

fHumble fHingaz · #4 (**permalink**) 10-15-2009, 05:47 AM

Very fat tone! The first one sounds slightly more "expensive" & refined, the second one is very raw & "in your face" (with just a hint of muddiness, nothing to worry about). Both are very good - well done!

Vanan · #5 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 02:56 AM

Who woulda thunk that the tone from my cheapo go-to-for-everything Wensen Custom guitar would be the one to save the day? Beefed up the levels on that track more and hard panned them too. Used a low pass filter at around 2K on the other hard panned guitar tracks (recorded with my Epi Explorer with EMG 81's).
Think I've found the right rhythm sound for this song. One down, 6 more to go! lol! Would love to know what you guys think of this rhythm tone. Overall a lot less harsh I think. A/b'ed it with LOG's and Megadeth's (United Abominations) guitar sound.

Thanks for the comments so far guys! This is so awesome, borrowing more ears for a listen.

P.S. I think I'm done for now. Won't be flooding the forums anymore... for now.

cakewalkgg · #6 (**permalink**) 10-16-2009, 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vanan

Who woulda thunk that the tone from my cheapo go-to-for-everything Wensen Custom guitar would be the one to save the day? Beefed up the levels on that track more and hard panned them too. Used a low pass filter at around 2K on the other hard panned guitar tracks (recorded with my Epi Explorer with EMG 81's).
Think I've found the right rhythm sound for this song. One down, 6 more to go! lol! Would love to know what you guys think of this rhythm tone. Overall a lot less harsh I think. A/b'ed it with LOG's and Megadeth's (United Abominations) guitar sound.

Thanks for the comments so far guys! This is so awesome, borrowing more ears for a listen.

P.S. I think I'm done for now. Won't be flooding the forums anymore... for now.

it is less harsh, and sounds decent.. to my ears it sounds a bit sterile.. I know thats an overused description. It could use some body.. some boost in low mid freq.. if its there to boost.. It just needs that crunchy bite

you have made improvements so far in this your on the right track..

awaken1 · #7 (**permalink**) 10-18-2009, 10:01 AM

It sounds good, and I agree, a cool riff like that, especially at :55 definately could do no wrong in having a little more crunch and balls to it.

Danny Danzi · #8 (**permalink**) 10-18-2009, 12:04 PM

Van: I think this is what one could be called "a pop mix" and let me explain what I mean by that before you impale me. LOL! A pop mix reference usually means clear and in need of some lows and mids. The thickness of some pop mixes are lacking and I believe this is what we're hearing here.

The mix itself is very well done, but needs more power from lows to mids. It's all highs to my ears. Guitars are a bit razor sharp, bass is barely audible and is felt more than it's heard. That said it IS a good mix, but for this style of music you defintely need more body going on in the guitars as well as the drums...and the bass needs work in the 120 to 200 range with a bit of a sparkle at about 2k. Make sure sub lows from 60 on down are controlled on the bass via highpass. I know you just did a quick bass track...so you can ignore the above if you choose to.

Guitars are still a bit brittle to me. Your mid freqs that I would work on are from 640hz to about 800hz. Don't worry about 500 as it could bring in some rumble and nasty mid range congestion. 640hz on up to about 800hz will give you the definition you're lacking.

Run a low shelf eq on your guitars from 120hz on down and start with a Q of about 4.0. Bring that level up a little at a time until you start to hear and feel a little low end start to come creeping into the picture. You may need to bring it up +4dB or more to hear a difference because there is no low end in these guitars at all on my end.

One thing I do appreciate is the fact that you don't have so much low end in your guitars that they are "whoomfing". So it's good you laid back on the low end, but you definitely have enough room to add some lows. Same with kick and snare...they seem a little thin in the low end area.....like everything needs a bit more body and mid range.

Let me ask you...because this concerns me a little. When you put on a mix of a band you would compare your stuff to, do you hear the additional low end they are using compared to your mix? If you can't hear the lows, it's your monitors and you probably need either better monitors and room correction man. The good thing is this mix is good level wise for the most part, but the eq's you used suggest to me that you ARE hearing low end on your side and this is what is transferring.

Make sure...and this is EXTREMELY important....that you NEVER and I repeat....NEVER use any external eq or other enhancements in Windows media play, winamp or whatever you use to review material. It should be a rule that all engineers never use any of that additional 3d, surround or bass enhancement stuff in their players because they create a sound that is not true. All eq's flat, no surround or 3d, no bass boosts of any kind.

Make sure you don't have any of that stuff on and listen to this again with it disabled if you had anything like that on. If your monitors are true sounding, you will hear in 5 seconds what I'm talking about. Hope some of this helps...best of luck to you.

Vanan · #9 (**permalink**) 10-18-2009, 03:34 PM

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