Please bash my song !!!!

[Dinaiz]

Hey everybody !

I'm a total noob in the domain of sound engineering ! I spent a lot of time reading web sites and magazines about the art of mixing, but I just don't have any practical experience.

This is my first try using "mixing" techniques, but I heard it so many times that I'm not sure I still can have an opinion about what's wrong in it. That's where I need your help !!!

You remember the crappy day you had at work ? Ok now it's time to focus all the hate in your heart and get rid of it by bashing this song ! Please be mean !

Cheers

[Feedback]

First I suggest you post your song as an attachment instead of posting a link to another site.

First of all, nothing sounds harsh or hurt the ears, so it's a good start. The synth choice is good. Now the first thing I noticed is that the drums need much more volume. You could try to simply turn them up. In electronic music, the percussion usually have a lot of compression on them. You could try to put a compressor on the drums and EQ them, for example, give the bass drum some more bass to have it THUMP instead of just quietly banging in the back of the mix.

Also, what program do you use to mix your songs and what effects or plugins you have access to? It would be easier to direct you if we know that.

[Dinaiz]

First, thank you for taking the time to review my track. Much aprreciated !

Originally Posted by Feedback

First I suggest you post your song as an attachment instead of posting a link to another site.

Yep good idea. That's done !

Originally Posted by Feedback

First of all, nothing sounds harsh or hurt the ears, so it's a good start. The synth choice is good.

Cool.

Originally Posted by Feedback

Now the first thing I noticed is that the drums need much more volume. You could try to simply turn them up. In electronic music, the percussion usually have a lot of compression on them. You could try to put a compressor on the drums and EQ them, for example, give the bass drum some more bass to have it THUMP instead of just quietly banging in the back of the mix.

All right, that's the kind of thing as was unsure about, so thanks a lot ! Actually, my drums are very close to "red" in the vu metter. Maybe I should compress more and/or lower the other instruments ?

Originally Posted by Feedback

Also, what program do you use to mix your songs and what effects or plugins you have access to? It would be easier to direct you if we know that.

I'm mainly using Ableton Live, along with the included effects. So in term of mixing, I have access to a parametric EQ, a graphic one, reverb, delay, a spectrum analyser (but no spectrogram, I've been looking for a free one for ages but couldn't find one !) , and a compressor. No enhancer. so I do that manualy (hard pan left, and right for the same track, and a slight delay, < 30 ms)

My main problems lay with reverbs (which sound a bit metallic) and EQ, which I tweek, but I'm not sure I'm doing this correctly.

I tried to give a separate frequency space to every instrument, which is fine, except for bass and kick. When I cut my low cut my bass slightly over 70 hz, which is the peak frequency of my kick, I'm loosing all it's power.

[Dinaiz]

Ok here's a new version. Is it better ?

[Feedback]

Cool, I also use ableton live. Yeah, in my opinion the second mix sounds muuch much better.

It surprises me though that you don't have a spectrogram, because i have live 7 and it has one, so i guess you have 6, cause if i remember well live 6 didnt have one.

Now as for the drums being close to red in the vu meter, i get ya. When you compress it, it basically makes the loudest peaks in your drum sound quieter, so that you can turn the overall volume of the drums higher, so you get the impression that they have much more power, but when i listen to your second mix, you pretty much figured it out.

When you listen to your song and compare it to other electronic, dance or techno songs, youll probably notice that the songs from the pros are really loud. Some people like it more when thwy have the impression that its louder. When I do my electronic mixes in live, I usually turn the whole thing up with an effect called saturator on the master track, i don't remember if earlier versions of live had it, but you could pretty much obtain the same result out of a compressor by tweaking it a little. But just to show you the difference that it makes, I imported your song in live and simply slapped a saturator on the master track, changed the setting to soft sine, and it already sounds much louder. Now it would probably need a little tweaking to make it sound just right, and you have to be careful with compression on the master track, cause too much of it will make it sound squished, but thats pretty much the basis of the mastering i do.

[Dinaiz]

Originally Posted by Feedback

It surprises me though that you don't have a spectrogram, because i have live 7 and it has one, so i guess you have 6, cause if i remember well live 6 didnt have one.

Nooo, I'm under live 7 too. Live 7 has a spectum analyzer (the one called spectrum). The spectrogram is something which produces results like the one you can see here : http://www.icsi.berkeley.edu/Speech/...pectrogram.gif

Basically, it's a frequency analysis, but over time. Basically you can achieve the same result with a regular spectrum which allows you to hold the peaks, so it's not THAT uselful.

Originally Posted by Feedback

Now as for the drums being close to red in the vu meter, i get ya. When you compress it, it basically makes the loudest peaks in your drum sound quieter, so that you can turn the overall volume of the drums higher, so you get the impression that they have much more power, but when i listen to your second mix, you pretty much figured it out.

Yeah I used that technique, and also sidechained the bass just a little bit, to make the kick sound louder.

Originally Posted by Feedback

When you listen to your song and compare it to other electronic, dance or techno songs, youll probably notice that the songs from the pros are really loud. Some people like it more when thwy have the impression that its louder. When I do my electronic mixes in live, I usually turn the whole thing up with an effect called saturator on the master track, i don't remember if earlier versions of live had it, but you could pretty much obtain the same result out of a compressor by tweaking it a little. But just to show you the difference that it makes, I imported your song in live and simply slapped a saturator on the master track, changed the setting to soft sine, and it already sounds much louder. Now it would probably need a little tweaking to make it sound just right, and you have to be careful with compression on the master track, cause too much of it will make it sound squished, but thats pretty much the basis of the mastering i do.

This trick is awesome, thank you. I think it sounds better with the saturator than with the compressor actually :-)

[Feedback]

Uoh, im gonna have to learn more about that spectrometer, looks like a fun tool. And about the saturator i get ya, i also tried to make a mix louder by putting a compressor on the master bus, but the saturator always seemed to work better. Only thing is that its hard to tweak it in details, like theres a lot of difference between analog clip, soft sine and medium sine.

[Dinaiz]

OK so I have a look at this saturator more in detail. The spectrum analyser is very usefull if you're not too experienced, and want to easily make your mixes sound better. You just have to put one in every chanel, and make EQ settings so that the frequencies ranges don't overlap between chanels, without destroying too much the sound of each chanel. Well after writting this sentence, I realize it's actually not easy at all ;-).

[zaporzan]

It's a interesting intro, certainly sets the mood. The bells play their roll, but they're becoming somewhat repetitive. Very good placement with the strings. Good melody introduced around 1:00. The drums sound kinda flat too me. I really really like the melodies you layed out here, they match very well. ooo except for that fill around 2:05. A rather abrupt drop into the outro.

Not bad! I would suggest using more automation when introducing instruments (unless it's after a drop or coming into part of the chorus). Buff up your drums a bit. And keep up the research you said you were doing!

[Dinaiz]

Cool ! That's a very detailled review, and certainly helpfull !!!

Originally Posted by zaporzan

It's a interesting intro, certainly sets the mood. The bells play their roll, but they're becoming somewhat repetitive.

Yeah, +1 ! The first version had bells ALL ALONG ! I cut them a bit, but I think I have to introduce more variations (different melodies and/or instruments, to set up a kind of a crescendo)

Originally Posted by zaporzan

The drums sound kinda flat too me. [...] Buff up your drums a bit.

Agreed, but what would you suggest for that ? More compression ? Different balance between instruments ? Different EQ ? Different tracking ?

Originally Posted by zaporzan

Not bad! I would suggest using more automation when introducing instruments (unless it's after a drop or coming into part of the chorus).

Like volume automation ? Do you mean at the begining, after the intro ? Before the "solos" ?


Thanks A LOT for this review !