Fairly New Electronic Music Producer In Need Of Help

[grugg]

Hi y'all @ Recording Review, I've been making electronic music now for about 3yrs

I thought I have progressed in the final sound to mastering stage, but when I finally got uploaded to myspace I heard abit more of the "big gun" tracks and mine just sound abit (in a few words) softer, un-clear and not as big sounding

I've uploaded a track that is the absolute best I can get so far

I did a EMP (Electronic Music Producer) course about 2yrs ago, and was ripped off big time paying $3000.00, it was all introductions > very beginners level. Thinking I was going to get alot more out of it as they clearly said it was for existing producers wanting to upgrade skills etc.. To which I knew pretty much half of what they taught.

Any feedback, tips or tricks of the trade to getting the fuller clearer bigger sound would be greatly appreciated

Heres the list of equipment I'm currently using

- iMac 2.8ghz Intel core 2 Duo, 4GB 667 Mhz DDR2 (OSX 10.5.6)
- Focusrite Saffire Pro 10
- Roland DM-2100 2.1 speaker system (2 x 15w satelite units + 50w subwoofer) (I know 1 know pretty cheap, still haven't upgraded) Would this be part of the reason? And any recommendations?
- Cubase 4, Ableton Live 7
- T-rackS 3 Mastering software

Thanks & Regards
Greg

[brandondrury]

Hey Greg,

The genre you are mixing here is 100% subjective. All tones sound good right out of the gate so it's simply a matter of playing with them to get what you want.

With that said, I would have went a different route on most of this. I would have wanted the drums to be pounding harder. I would have squashed them to get them pumping. I'd want to squeeze more sustain out of those drums for this.

You can hear this clearly at 0:19 when the hihat comes in. Those drums are clearly taking a passive / submissive stance. That's not the direction I would have went for.

That "noise" which I'm calling a bass but sounds more like a deep distorted piano is quite loud throughout. While certainly not wrong, I wouldn't have highlighted it that much.

Brandon

[PeterSimonRussell]

Hi Grugg, this isn't my sort of music - I 've been commenting on the metal / rock stuff which is really of an excellent standard - and I thought I'd have a listen at something else. I agree with most of what our supreme overlord said - not that I'm sucking up to him or anything. ....

Just a couple of comments
1. Its not you gear that's the issue
2. Do you lose the beat for too long at 1:07 and at 2:20 the plinky plonky bit is not in time?
3. Really like the pick up at 2:56

LOve,


The TIgs

[grugg]

Thanks for the input guys - brandon & peter

The kick really sounds thumping in mastering program and b4 mixdown. It also sounds like its too loud when I tried to make the kick louder. Maybe another check into that is needed.

Sorry I'm not fully upto standards yet with the producer talk, when you say squash the drums what exactly do you mean?
And sustain as a add a dynamic maximizer effect to them?

Also with the sound not up to standards, is it a good Idea if I attach link to another producers track to compare so you can fully understand what I'm trying to get across?

2. Do you lose the beat for too long at 1:07 and at 2:20 the plinky plonky bit is not in time? Heh heh plinky plonky, nice one!
Yeh I actually wanted it to sound out abit, or it sounds to neat and normal. I know thats abit stupid, but i thought it came out better that way.

3. Really like the pick up at 2:56- Cheers' nice itn't

Also would it be a worthy idea to upgrade monitors to get a clearer picture of what I'm going to get on other speaker applications? My rolands are pretty stock standard, probably under.

Thanks again guys, much appreciated
Greg

[brandondrury]

The kick really sounds thumping in mastering program and b4 mixdown. It also sounds like its too loud when I tried to make the kick louder. Maybe another check into that is needed.

I'm not exactly talking level per say. I'm talking about apparent volume. There is a huge difference. You are right. If you just turn what you've got hear up, it could be too loud. The idea is to use compression to get the drums really pumping so they sound like they are knocking the hell out of you even if they are actually lower in level. It's all an illusion, really.

For example, Nickelback's drums in "Something In Your Mouth" are stupidly powerful. They are so big, monstrous, and mean that it's stupid. However, they aren't using all that much peak level because of the way that mastering has to crush everything. They are doing it with compression. I hit this topic in Killer Home Recording (Drums and Murderous Mixing) which I'm REALLY working hard to have out in the next two weeks.

It needs to be said that maybe you aren't looking for knock you on your ass drums. You may have a different vision and that is totally okay. So don't let me change your mind. I just would have went the pounding route on this.

Also with the sound not up to standards

This is hog wash. There are no standards. Not really. At least with electronic music there are zero standards. If you approach this whole music thing like you are filling out a 1040 tax return you've missed the boat. You are looking for an emotional response from your music. That's the point to mixing.

Also would it be a worthy idea to upgrade monitors to get a clearer picture of what I'm going to get on other speaker applications? My rolands are pretty stock standard, probably under.

Studio monitoring is the most important piece of the puzzle. Without out it you are flying blind. However, you've also got to look at room acoustics too because a simple monitor upgrade in a non treated room kind of defeats the purpose.

I'd take a look at these. I've been super happy with mine. They don't replace my big studio monitors, but they almost do and they do it with zero room acoustic treatment.

Brandon

[grugg]

Ahhhh man, went to do this on many occassions and tried the compressor on the kick drum but got side-tracked every time and took it off as it wasn't sounding right. Thanks mate, this will be my homework! and study it alot more this time i will.

Yeh correct you are, wasn't going for crazy stupid drums, heh, but something with abit more bang to it definitley.

Studio monitoring is the most important piece of the puzzle. Without out it you are flying blind. However, you've also got to look at room acoustics too because a simple monitor upgrade in a non treated room kind of defeats the purpose.

Uhuh I found the quote link. heh.
Yeh I've probably got the worst environment, big room, corner speakers, plenty of windows and external noises.

Cool I'll check out those headphones

Thanks again for your help
Cheers'

[trancespotter]

Like Brandon already said, the kick needs some working on. Maybe even try a different kick drum or try making your own. Vengeance samples usually need little processing to them so you might want to check those out.

As far as levels, trance/house/industrial usually has the kick drum as the loudest part of the track followed by the bass. in my experience, i've found that having the kick drum peak at around -6, the bass peak around -10, and everything else be lower than that works generally well.

also if you really want the kick to start pumping everything, you could sidechain the bass, cymbals, claps, and anything else to the kick. good examples of this are Benny Benassi - Satisfaction and Eric Prydz - Call on Me.

YouTube - Benny Benassi Satisfaction [Long Version] <--- Benny Benassi

YouTube - Eric Prydz - Call On Me <-- Eric Prydz

[andrewmaris]

i agree with these guys, doing some work on the drums in this one would make a huge difference. the kick drum needs more power - have you eq'd it at all to give it more low end? its about more than volume. you could also overlay the current kick drum with a separate patch that has more low end character so that you get the mix cutting "snap" of the current kick along with the powerful "thud". of course you would want to heavily compress this like brandon was saying. i also agree on the more agressive hi hats. everything else sounds good quality to me - very infected mushroom-ish psytrancy stuff (which is built around driving drum mixes so there you go!) good work man - you should remix it and repost it

[dmmi]

I don't agree.....with the overlord...the build is to 2:57, and then it gets pumping

I love it.....I see deepness that is not present in a lot of music of this genre.

SWEET!