10 Questions for a career in live/Studio mixer engineering

[DCstudio10]

I have some questions for a career in live/Studio mixer engineering:

1. What kind of education Will i need?
2.What kind of schools are there? where are they?
3.What classes are there in community college or trade school that might help me?
4 What kind of budget is it for schooling, tuition, books Ect..?
5. Better working for yourself or a company? (what kind of benefits)
6.What are the High and low Pay?
7.Where is the best city to work at?
8.Are there opportunity for advancement in this career?(what level do i start at where do i go?)
9.What are some qualities i should have?
10. Is the outlook on this career positive or negative? why?


Also if this is a career for you what does a typical day for you look? What kind of work setting do you have?


Thank you for taking the time to answer all this
Hey Brandon Drury may I have a little input from you?

[glenlata]

well i'll go ahead and give this a shot, not a career engineer, but i do it during all of my free time, which is whenever im not on my 9-5 sometimes i even forget to sleep but anyways, im sure the more experienced people will have better answers, also these questions have been answered in various other threads but what the hey.

1.you don't need any formal training although it would help you immensely its not required

2.i only know of 2 schools as in i know people that went to them, one is full sail and the other is berklee, although from what i know berklee is mostly for musicians, not sure on that one, but i'm sure there are others and i'm sure they are everywhere, well in most major cities probably.

3.not sure if you'd fine audio engineering in a trade school or a CC, at least not around where im at in tallahassee florida.

4.my friend that went to full sail said he was paying like 8-10k or something like that a year in tuitions.

5.cant answer this one as i have never worked for a company, and i dont think i would want to, i like freelance to much i hate having a boss.

6.this one is all over the place, some guys here do it for free, some guys charge 5-10 dollars and hour, while the 3 studios we have in town charge $75-150 an hour. it all depends on how much you value yourself and the kind of people you bring in.

7. this one depends on genre, IMO, generally you want a bigger city, preferably one rich in music and arts. I shy away from cities like atlanta and new york tho, there is a studio on every corner and in every house. and i can say that about both of them because i've been to both places.

8.i assume if you get hired onto a company they may have lvls, as a freelancer tho you are what you are, an audio engineer, and you general earn what your worth.

9. again IMO depends on genre, but in all cases being a perfectionist isn't a bad quality. Persistance, Honesty, integrity (that means no shortcuts cause they wont notice the difference). perseverance, being a audiophile doesn't hurt. but basically the usual, you do have to love music, and sometime see the good in the bad. attention to detail is also a must.

10. i'd say the outlook isn't to great what with every person in the world having a studio in there home, and charging and trying to get people into it. but if you can persevere all that and get good and make a name for yourself. alot of door start to open up. still in the stages of that, i have a small buzz in the hip hop community and have been working with a few up and comers lately, but still not where i want to be.

cant answer that last one cause i don't do this for a living, i take projects i like and i book when i feel like it.

[venuestudio]

1. What kind of education Will i need?
-None really but there is quite of bit of OJT to be done.

2.What kind of schools are there? where are they?
There are the Full Sails type of places and then there are places like Berklee in Boston.

3.What classes are there in community college or trade school that might help me? Full Sail is a trade school in my mind.

4 What kind of budget is it for schooling, tuition, books Ect..?
-Do not know.

5. Better working for yourself or a company? (what kind of benefits)
-Depends on if you want to make money, and you will not make any money either way for the first few years.

6.What are the High and low Pay?
-Zero to not enough...

7.Where is the best city to work at?
-New York, Boston, LA, Nashville, Austin for starters (studio work). Any city for live sound to start.

8.Are there opportunity for advancement in this career?(what level do i start at where do i go?)
-Only for the very good and the very lucky!

9.What are some qualities i should have?
-Learn to listen to the client. Remember you are never right, They are!! Get to work before everyone and be the last to leave.

10. Is the outlook on this career positive or negative? why?
-Negative from my perspective. Home studios and mixing over the internet is killing the big studios. Look around this site, hundreds of guys doing the home studio thing. I doubt there are more than a handful that make a living on it and even fewer making a good living.

Live sound (right now) is tough too. You have to find a band that is making enough to support a dedicated engineer and they are few and far between. Oh and you have to be a good engineer and have a serious system. I carried $40K worth of gear to support the band I worked with to get paid $400 per night, and as an independent that was good money. You can work for some of the bigger live houses (Claire Brothers, etc.) but it is not going to pay much and the travel is brutal. Begin a roadie can not suck enough! Crappy hours, hard work, low pay, cheap hotels (if you don't sleep in the truck).

[DCstudio10]

Thank you venuestudio and glenlata Any more?

[bozmillar]

1. What kind of education Will i need?
- If you have a good "demo reel" then that is worth as much if not more than any degree.

2.What kind of schools are there? where are they?
- If you want to make money doing this, it's more about self promotion and marketing. I think a business degree would qualify you more and get you more expertise in the field than some made up music degree.

3.What classes are there in community college or trade school that might help me?
- I think on the job training is worth far more than education, although, depending on your level, you might benefit from taking a small course to get you started. Once you have the basics down, it's all about practicing. Depending on your financial obligations, you can try looking for different jobs that are beyond just mixing/recording. Look at local TV stations. If you are going to school to get a degree, look for a part time job on campus. There are plenty of creative services that need mixing/engineering type work.

4 What kind of budget is it for schooling, tuition, books Ect..?
- Depends on what type of school you plan on attending.

5. Better working for yourself or a company? (what kind of benefits)
- If you work for a company, it's generally more stable, but you do the work you are told to do. If you work for yourself, the amount of money you make is directly related to how well you market yourself.

6.What are the High and low Pay?
Depends on how good a businessman you are. It seems a lot of people end up spending more on gear than they'll ever make back.

7.Where is the best city to work at?
- I don't know.

8.Are there opportunity for advancement in this career?(what level do i start at where do i go?)

9.What are some qualities i should have?

10. Is the outlook on this career positive or negative? why?
- This depends on what you are willing to do. If you are going to say "I will only work in a studio as a mixing engineer" then your outlook will likely be negative. If you are willing to branch out and find ways to make money, then the outlook is positive.

I think too many people (I'm not saying you) have a rockstar mentality about recording music. The truth is that it's a form of work that a lot of people want to do, and nobody wants to pay for. I personally think that the trick is to diversify your self.

Think of different ways to make money. Teach piano/guitar/drum/oboe lessons. Learn to write music. Learn to record/produce music for yourself. Learn to record/produce music for other people. Learn to play live so you can get with a good band. Learn how to mix live shows. Learn how to record live shows. Learn how to make people think you like their songs when you are recording them. Learn to write film scores. Learn audio DSP. Write plugins.

If you start out diversified, you'll be able to find 100 little jobs that all add up to the income of one normal job. As you get better at each of them, they will build off each other. For example, your teaching guitar will make you a better guitar player, which will make you a better studio musician, which will force you to learn different styles of music, which will help you to learn more instruments, which will help you teach more instruments. That will help you be a better producer, and you will produce better bands. You can then make the decision of what you like doing, and what makes you the most money, and go with it.

[garageband]

9. What are some qualities I should have?

I'll take this one. A deep and boundless knowledge of the mechanics of music. It's simply not possible to know too much. The ability to find the craft and artistry in music you don't personally care for. Sensible attention to detail. Also, perfectionism is no virtue.

Being clean, polite and on-time is necessary, as well.

[String7th]

I think my answer for #10 says a lot more so I put it first.

10. Is the outlook on this career positive or negative? why?
Auto Mechanic is a career. Cosmetology is a career. Proctologist is a career. This is something else. There's no simple path to take or easy road to follow. Paying $18,000 a year in Full-Sail tuition fees and free interning at a studio depends only on your budget. How good you are and what you did to get that good have nothing to do with eachother. Rick Ruben gets paid a million dollars an album and has no clue what a Lynx Aurora converter does, and probably no clue what phantom power is. But there's hundreds of studios all over the US charging locals bands $50/hr and making crappy bands sound awesome. It's kinda like going to school to become a celebrity.

1. What kind of education Will i need?
Hands-on experience and "trial and error"; either by yourself or in a classroom.

2.What kind of schools are there? where are they?
Some big names are Full Sail, SAE, even local schools like here in TX (Dallas Sound Lab) is reputable. But you would be surprised what your local community college offers.

3.What classes are there in community college or trade school that might help me?
The class that would help the most is buisiness management and Music business. The rest depends on your budget.

4 What kind of budget is it for schooling, tuition, books Ect..?
I know the big boys can be a few thousand a year, but I'm going to be taking electrical engineering and music buisiness classes at my community college and it looks to be less than a $1000 a year for a lot of stuff I can use for continuing education.

5. Better working for yourself or a company? (what kind of benefits)
It's not comparable to, example, being a freelance tax prep clerk or working for H&R Block. A major studio will be owned by a regular Joe who's probably got a few gold records under his belt, been in the business for decades, and has most of the A&R reps' cell numbers for RCA records in his phone. You can blindly apply for internship to 846 studios around the USA and Europe and get 3 calls.

6.What are the High and low Pay?
For your fisrt year or 2 at a major studio, you won't get paid. For your first 2-3 years on your own, you will make about a third as much as you spend on equipment. As a freelancer, If you record a band that gets signed and tours the world, you can pretty much charge anything you want and people will pay it.

7.Where is the best city to work at?
Two options, whoever brings you on as an intern, that's where you move to. Or as a freelancer, where the population is overcrowded and cost of living is ridiculous. NYC and Los Angeles come first to mind. Or you could start in your own area.

8.Are there opportunity for advancement in this career?(what level do i start at where do i go?)
Start as a noob and get good, then learn every new technique and new technology that comes out. Just like IT world, technology never stops so there's always more to learn.

9.What are some qualities i should have?
A lot of money, free time, patience, and ability to deal with stupid people.

[glenlata]

Originally Posted by String7th

[I]
ability to deal with stupid people.

Yes YES and god dangit i said YESSSS!!!!!!!
the average musician trying to make it is dumb as rocks, and that might be a compliment to some. You have to learn to understand and speak stupid. alot of them will also think that they know it all already so you have to understand how to speak stupid without sounding like your speaking stupid. Tact is a must.
you don't realize how stupid and easily influenced people can be until you start talking about art and politics. unfortunately for us aspiring engineers, the world of music seems to be a bit of both.

[garageband]

Originally Posted by String7th

10. Is the outlook on this career positive or negative? why?
Auto Mechanic is a career. Cosmetology is a career. Proctologist is a career. This is something else. There's no simple path to take or easy road to follow. Paying $18,000 a year in Full-Sail tuition fees and free interning at a studio depends only on your budget. How good you are and what you did to get that good have nothing to do with eachother. Rick Ruben gets paid a million dollars an album and has no clue what a Lynx Aurora converter does, and probably no clue what phantom power is. But there's hundreds of studios all over the US charging locals bands $50/hr and making crappy bands sound awesome. It's kinda like going to school to become a celebrity.

My favorite advice thus far. At the end of the day, a vast majority of the stuff you really need to know isn't taught at school. Not really any different than writing, painting or any other artistic pursuit. Rick Ruben makes the money he does because of the nature of his artistry, same with the $50 an hour guy editing and sample replacing and pitch correcting marginal bands into listenableness. Sure, you do need to know to drive the car, how it works, what goes on on the race track and how other people might drive it but all that knowledge won't make you Mark Martin. Of course, thisis not saying you'll never be that good. More along of the lines of pointing out that there is no linear relationship between formal schooling and commercial success in artistic fields of endeavor.