Do I need an audio interface if I have a/d d/a converters and preamps?

[elmosgota50cal]

Hi. Just a basic question. I have a presonus firebox and a firestudio. I am going to buy some high quality a/d d/a converters (Not sure which ones. Thinking of getting a Universal Audio 2192 for now, but am also looking at the apogee da x16 and ad x16 and an RME 8 QS M) and some preamps (api 3124, neve 2-610). Do I need an audio interface, or do the converters work in their stead? What do the pros do?

Any info appreciated greatly.

[fmw]

Do you think the new gear will produce any meaningful sonic differences from what you already have?

[elmosgota50cal]

That coming from the guy who as a (Neumann?) as his display pic.

I know that I am hearing the limitations of my gear, having worked with it for 3+ years and having tried every possible trick and technique to improve my sound, (room acoustics, mixing, proper miking etc.) so yes, I do believe it will help improve how my music sounds. That said, obviously all the gear in the world does not a good song make, but there is a clear and audible difference in something well-recorded from a firebox and something well-recorded from thousands of dollars of rackmount gear etc. Before you ask...yes, I do have a few thousand to spend, and I am prepared for the financial hit if it means getting me closer to pro-quality sound.

[fmw]

OK. All I can say is that the difference between what you have and what you want to buy is not the difference between amateur and pro sound. I hope you aren't disappointed. To answer your question, I recommend you go to Welcome to Sweetwater.com | Call Us @ 800 222 4700 and review the various preamps and AD/DA units there. It will tell you which ones have a computer interface and which do not. Sweetwater doesn't sell Neve but you can find details at Rupert Neve Designs . Take care.

[richiebee]

Can we hear some of your stuff elmosgota50cal? I'm curious to hear where you're at with the stuff you have. Maybe you're way further ahead than you should be with the gear you've got, but I have a feeling you're seeking something that gear can't provide.

[elmosgota50cal]

Those are just things I am looking at. I am a newb, I know, so bear with me...are the below assumptions of mine correct?

To get pro sound you need:

*Above all the ability to mix and record like the pros. (Obviously. Don't have that yet, but want to get there one day.)

*Highest quality mics, preamps, converters, etc.

*An acoustically sound room.

*Good monitors.

What else am I missing? What do you think I need to purchase to be up to snuff gear wise? Tell me, however expensive it may be. I don't want to be ignorant of what goes into making pro-level recordings. I want to get a firm understanding of the basics involved.

I also have a fair amount of coin, so I would be surprised if I couldn't manage to purchase some pro-level gear...at least to get a few channels.

[fmw]

Originally Posted by elmosgota50cal

That coming from the guy who as a (Neumann?) as his display pic.

.

The mic in my avatar is a $229 Rode NT-1. The NT-1 is the mic I use to record my own voice. I use it more than any other, including my small collection of Neumanns.

Here's my take on your questions. In my experience the most important elements in high quality recording are these in order of importance.

1. skill of the recordist.

2. room acoustics. Room reverb, noise, isolation, etc. etc. etc. have more to do with the sound you capture than the equipment you use to capture it.

3. microphone selection and placement,

4. everything else.

Perhaps others will disagree but that's the way I would rank them. I have personally done over 30 bias controlled objective DAC listening tests over the past 10 years and I can tell you with a lot of confidence that ADC's and DAC's are not the place to spend your money.

And as a conductor of bias controlled listening tests I can tell you that saying something like "I know that I am hearing the limitations of my gear" doesn't strike a chord with me unless you conducted some bias controlled listening tests comparing different pieces of gear to deliver a statistically valid result. Conducting bias controlled listening tests is not trivial. It is a time consuming hassle and requires a small group of people to get valid results.

I've looked over the specs of all kinds of mic preamps and those that provide specs generally have inaudible distortion and flat frequency response curves. That just means they will take the input from the mic and amplify the audio without making meaningful changes to the waveforms. In other words, they should all sound roughly alike. Any differences would be subtle at best.

Yes, there are mic preamps (mostly expensive ones) that do add a sonic signature to the audio but my own opinion is that you would do better to make those adjustments with something that is adjustable and defeatable, not a preamp. Lot's of people will disagree with that as well. But I don't think preamps are a good place to spend money either.

Just as microphones have a sonic signature at the beginning of the recording process, so loudspeakers have one at the end of the process. All speakers will sound different from one another. They suffer from distortion, enclosure resonances, crossover networks, phase anomalies and all kinds of other issues. Many mixes are made with monitors that have no bottom end and the results are overly bassy. That kind of thing matters to be sure. So, yes, monitors would be something I would consider reasonably important in the "everything else" category - way more important than ADC's or preamps. This is opinion again and not universal truth.

Mixing is done with software these days. If you like having a physical controller rather than using a mouse, that's fine. But don't expect a fancy mixer or controller to cure problems or to make your recordings better. It might make you feel better and it might save you time but I think that's not such a big issue for you.

So I would spend some resources on making your recording venue as good acoustically as you can. Then you can improve your microphones and monitors. All the while you can improve your techniques. Most of the guys on this forum have a lot more recording experience than I have. They can help you with technique better than I can. Spend some time picking their brains and experience. I'm just trying to give you some perspective from someone who has done a lot of audio testing.

[elmosgota50cal]

Originally Posted by richiebee

Can we hear some of your stuff elmosgota50cal? I'm curious to hear where you're at with the stuff you have. Maybe you're way further ahead than you should be with the gear you've got, but I have a feeling you're seeking something that gear can't provide.

So, if all a really big-name producer like Rick Rubin had was a Mac, Logic, a keyboard, a few sm57s, maybe some drums guitar and bass, and a firebox, he could make something sound pro? If so...great!

Egad no...I would NEVER play any of my music for anyone...ever...I don't pretend to be even somewhat of a songwriter...it's just for me. That said however, I do enjoy making it more than anything else, and am curious what it is going to cost to have some pro-level gear. It will take me years to acquire it, but so be it.

Thanks for the posts guys!!!

[elmosgota50cal]

[QUOTE=fmw;64696]And as a conductor of bias controlled listening tests I can tell you that saying something like "I know that I am hearing the limitations of my gear" doesn't strike a chord with me unless you conducted some bias controlled listening tests comparing different pieces of gear to deliver a statistically valid result/QUOTE]

Okay. It does sound like you have a ton of experience there. That's kind of relieving, cause I don't REALLY want to spend everything I have, although I am only using a beta 57a for vocals...run through the firebox...I think even someone with little knowledge of recording skills can hear the difference between a well recorded track from that setup and a well-recorded track from $20,000 worth of gear captured in an acoustically treated studio.

[fmw]

[QUOTE=elmosgota50cal;64702]

Originally Posted by fmw

...I think even someone with little knowledge of recording skills can hear the difference between a well recorded track from that setup and a well-recorded track from $20,000 worth of gear captured in an acoustically treated studio.

Probably so and I think most of the difference would be the studio itself, the microphones and the Engineer's skill. I'm not against high end gear. I'm just trying to provide some perspective. You should spend your money in whatever manner makes you happy.