Ozone3 and mixing and mastering when to limit?

[Nwahs]

So I mix my tracks in cubase4. I use Ozone for individual tracks and I also use it for mastering. So here is my question.

Should I use Ozone to limit, bump of the volume or final polish, on the out of my mix? Or should I mixdown my mix and use Ozone to bump the volume in a separate mastering session?

Doing this step in a separate mastering session always leads to me going back and adjusting the mix again.

[mrlindeman]

Originally Posted by Nwahs

So I mix my tracks in cubase4. I use Ozone for individual tracks and I also use it for mastering. So here is my question.

Should I use Ozone to limit, bump of the volume or final polish, on the out of my mix? Or should I mixdown my mix and use Ozone to bump the volume in a separate mastering session?

Doing this step in a separate mastering session always leads to me going back and adjusting the mix again.

Ok so correct me if I am wrong any where in this advise any one but here is what I woud do. In researching ozone I found that it does not show compression as an option? Well any ways. So get the mix sounding good as possible. I usually try to set my mind at that there will be no mastering and this is a one shot deal. It kinda helps me to not rely on mastering as a fix for anything. for individual tracks like bass, vocals and kick, snare, toms, compression can be used almost as an affect to get those tracks to set better in the mix when you go to the mixer too set every track in its place. once the mix, on its own sounds goood and you like to listen to it. Then go ahaid and use ozone to polish everything over. Limiting and or bumping the play volume should be the last thing in the chain during mastering. Basically the better and more even and meshed the mix is the better the final master will sound when you go to maximize the over all db of the song. This is just a basic of what I go off of for what I use. I dont have ozone unfortunatly, I cant afford it but i use g-vst and some other EQ plugins. This method works decent but I am still learning too. I hope I helped in some way. So get themix good then export it as a stereo wave, open that wave in your daw, or editing software/cubase. then master that track/song with ozone. sorry for the long post.

[Nwahs]

Long post is fine.

Ozone does have excellent compression, variable compression that can work similar to an intelligent para EQ.

Thanks for the info. I was trying to get it ready to go all at one time, but then I read advise saying to keep your mastering separate which just made me more confused. I'm thinking, am I loosing quality by doing most of the work during the mixing process?

Thanks

[garageband]

Originally Posted by Nwahs

I'm thinking, am I loosing quality by doing most of the work during the mixing process?

Thanks

Not quality, but control. Do mixing and mastering in separate steps. Less like herding cats.

[earshot]

It seems to me that if you are mastering your own work, its a bit redundant ´mastering´ in a separate session. Part of true mastering is having a second set of ears (hopefully experienced ears) evaluate your mix in an ideal acoustic environment. If you are simply talking about bus compression/limiting you might as well do that in session.
One thing i have been trying lately, particularly on more heavy genres of music is running a brickwall limiter across the bus and then doing the final mix tweaks with it in place. Heavy limiting basically reduces transient peak levels (ie drums) and increases rms level (eg distorted gats). I often find with the limiter in place i am wanting to bring down gat and drum overhead (cymbal)levels, while bringing the snare up a tad. My 2c,

Cheers

Matt

[garageband]

its a bit redundant ´mastering´ in a separate session.

No, it's not. Not at all. Not even slightly.

To the OP: Do this in two distinct steps and you will get better results right away.

Doing this step in a separate mastering session always leads to me going back and adjusting the mix again.

This is because the mixes need to be better. Tight mixes will stand up to necessary processing. Slapping on a bunch of junk on the 2-bus is not really making it sound better. For proof, take a mix slathered with 2-bus goo and bounce it into a new session. Once you turn your mix ears off and your mastering ears on, you'll see that you have boxed yourself in in certain places and created situations that you have to try to work out of. Better to start the fresh set of ears and a fresh approach to the track and using tools you don't use nor have access to at the tracking stage.

[earshot]

I think we both agree then that

- slapping a bunch of junk on your 2-bus isnt really mastering
- mastering your own work always presents the temptation of further mix tweaks, simply because you can

Cheers

Matt

[garageband]

mastering your own work always presents the temptation of further mix tweaks, simply because you can

A well-placed caution, here. Tweaking in the creativity killer. Make what you want to make and move on. Otherwise, you'll only make one thing.

[bozmillar]

I think the reason people like to export then master in a separate session is because it simulates a more real mastering environment. Obviously you can get equal results by doing it either way, but I agree they should be done separately. Reasons are:

1) it will teach you to mix properly. If you know it's going to be a pain to go back and re-export just to change the levels or eq in the mix, you will spend the time learning to get your mix right the first time.

2) you shouldn't be adjusting the mix to make up for poor mastering processing. If the mix sounds good, but then sounds less good after mastering, then the problem is not in the mix, it's in the mastering. If you are adjusting the eq in the guitars to get them to sound good in the already existing "mastering" eq, then the "mastering" eq is not set up right.

3) You can't really "master" a single song. Mastering is the process of taking a bunch of songs and making them flow together and making a product master. It means getting the fade ins/outs to sound right and getting the space between the songs to sound good. It means making sure there are no odd noises in between songs. It means putting the songs in the correct order and making sure the metadata is correct for each song.

Usually the process of getting all the songs to sound good together on the same CD requires some eq, compression and stereo effects and whatever other processing so that one song doesn't sound too mono, or another song sound too bright, or another too loud.

If you are just "mastering" a single song, it doesn't have to fit well with anything else because it's on its own. As long as it doesn't sound awkward or weak when played next to other professionally produced songs, then it's good to go. This way, you don't have to have the precision eq that you might need when mastering a full CD because the song that will play next will be from another artist, and nobody expects them to match perfectly.

So in short, if you are just applying effects to try to get the song to sound a little better, then sure, throw them on the 2bus, but if you are actually mastering the CD, you should export the songs and work on them as stereo files.