Mastering Myths and some cold hard facts Pt1

[Danny Danzi]

Thanks edub...actually, part 2 is already included in this if you look at the subject lines. I figured since this was already made a sticky (thanks to the mod that did that for us) I'd keep everything in here. Glad you enjoyed it, thanks!

[Danny Danzi]

Originally Posted by Svencanz

Hey Danny,

This little thing probably fits under this heading?

Audio mid/side encoder/decoder plugin - MSED - Voxengo

Where do I actually "connect it" in Cubase?
At the moment I only use the standard stereo buss, run all my tracks to that. I suspect with a "spacer" thing like this I might have to get into having more busses, or something?

Cheers,
Sven

Hi Sven,

I finally had a chance to spend some time with this plug. I first tried it on my master bus to see what it would do. Both Encode and Decode modes threw my vocals out of the center position to where it was just not a good thing. You can fix it, but it still just sounds off-set. However, Inline mode was a different animal. For the most part, from what I can tell, this plug is like a Waves S-1 or a PSP stereo enhancer type plug. It will widen the stereo field as well as give you control over the mono field. The funny thing for me was I decided to stop bypassing it and just leave it on and tweak it until it sounded right using inline mode on my mastering bus. When I finally bypassed it to listen to what I may have improved on or degraded, there was absolutely no difference. LOL!!! I literally set it to sound like the mix currently was without bypassing and checking it. I found that kinda strange.

Now, using this in a buss of instrumentation is a pretty cool thing. For example, I threw it on a guitar buss that had 4 guitars going on. It actually did a pretty decent job of controlling how wide the guitars would go. Used to the extreme is somewhat simulated going beyond the stereo field of hard left/hard right...which is common with most imaging type plugs. But, it didn't degrade the sound and totally separate the guitars from the mix like some plugs do. Encode, Decode and Inline gave me different results while in the guitar buss. Nothing was thrown out of whack like what happened on the master buss with the vocals. So, it's definitely a plug that needs to deal with stereo sound if you are to use both mid and side knobs.

I think it's a pretty cool plug actually and thank you for turning us onto it. I'm not sure I would use it as it really wasn't giving me anything that made me say "oh wow, I soo gotta use this" but I think the best way to use it would be on a track where you need a special effects type pan control. Queensryche uses stuff like this on some of Geoff Tates vocal lines or when they want something "special" to leap out at a listener. I don't know that I'd use this on a master buss, but perhaps an instrument buss or like I say, a track where we need some additional spacial sweetening. I'd definitely automate it and not just leave it on because it can defintely be abused especially if someone mixes with headphones on. It will simulate throwing the sound beyond the normal pan field and in most cases, this will separate a mix way too much for me. But for special effects, or instrument busses used in moderation or with automation, this is definitely a cool little plug.

I love the undo ability as well as the history menu. I think is should be mandatory for all plugins to have those features as they really can be quite helpful to us. Hope this helps...thanks again for sharing this.

[fHumble fHingaz]

How do I get my master super loud? The key to a super loud master is to have an incredible mix before it even gets mastered. This is why I have my clients send me files to listen to so I can tell them what to adjust before we go to the mastering process. The better the mix is on its own, the better it will sound when it's mastered and the louder it can be without distortion yet maintain dynamics at all times.

This is so true! A comprehensive analysis, Danny... A good mix is a good mix is a good mix - You can't go past it - get it happening at your master fader first!

[TonyB]

Originally Posted by fHumble fHingaz

This is so true! A comprehensive analysis, Danny... A good mix is a good mix is a good mix - You can't go past it - get it happening at your master fader first!

Good call! This can't be emphasized enough! You can't even start to think about getting a mix "loud" (sometimes I wish we can ban this word as well...there's a difference between a "loud" and "full" mix...but I digress) until the mix is right....and you can't get the mix right....unless the tracking is right...and the tracking won't be worth a hill of beans if the performance isn't there.....etc etc etc.

But it is the AE's responsiblity to make a good mix that will survive the ME's touch.

Brandon covers this very well in Murderous Mixing.

Okay, back to my **** milk and cookies now....listening to loud music!

[Don Moe]

First of all I would like to share something with all of you:

it`s great to find a community such as this, tons of real explanations and stuff that are very interesting.

2nd, i`m not really on the recording biz, although i like it a lot and have recorded some stuff for my own and for my band, wich is the main reasons why I was surfing on the net in order to find some answers, and that`s how i got to this thread and hope you can help me with some stuff that I don`t understand

Now, please let me introduce myself (just a little background) I`m from Mexico, sing and play guitar on a local band that has just recently signed an indy label deal, we`ve have managed to get a regular studio to record that material here in mexico and the master process in going to be done somewhere in sweden, so a lot of clouds are just appearing in my mind...

In what kind of format do we need to send the "recordings" or the songs so the engineer can work the master there in europe?

We need to send him the whole session or what needs to be done?

i hope i made myself clear, my english is not quite accurate these days,

hope to read something from you guys and thanks a lot for reading this

Originally Posted by Danny Danzi

There are times when you shouldn't even waste the money going to an engineer to get things mastered. If you are just giving out a demo to people or are a hobbiest, there is no reason to spend the money on an engineer unless it's something you just want to sound great. If you will be selling the cd or have an indy label deal, by all means don't even procrastinate and waste your time trying to do this on your own. You're too close to the material to make the right calls. Trust me when I tell you!

[Danny Danzi]

Originally Posted by Don Moe

First of all I would like to share something with all of you:

it`s great to find a community such as this, tons of real explanations and stuff that are very interesting.

2nd, i`m not really on the recording biz, although i like it a lot and have recorded some stuff for my own and for my band, wich is the main reasons why I was surfing on the net in order to find some answers, and that`s how i got to this thread and hope you can help me with some stuff that I don`t understand

Now, please let me introduce myself (just a little background) I`m from Mexico, sing and play guitar on a local band that has just recently signed an indy label deal, we`ve have managed to get a regular studio to record that material here in mexico and the master process in going to be done somewhere in sweden, so a lot of clouds are just appearing in my mind...

In what kind of format do we need to send the "recordings" or the songs so the engineer can work the master there in europe?

We need to send him the whole session or what needs to be done?

i hope i made myself clear, my english is not quite accurate these days,

hope to read something from you guys and thanks a lot for reading this

Hi Don,

I'd suggest contacting the mastering engineer before you do anything. Most times they want wave files of the tunes exported out of your audio editor at a certain peak level along with stems of the audio files individually. But please don't take my word for this because every mastering engineer has his own set of rules and demands. Contact them or tell the label to do it and get back to you with the proper information. Best of luck!

[Don Moe]

Mr. Danzi, thanx a lot for the extremely-fast-responsonse-advise, i`m gonna ask the engineer then,

but just as a mere example, how do you often tend to work on a situation like this?
Do you require an specific kind of recording sofware? is there a standard for this or you can use any kind of program and then master the session?

by the way, your music RRRReally kicks ass!!! i was listening to it at myspace my respects to you!

[Danny Danzi]

Hi Don, thanks very much for the kind words. You can call me Danny if you want, but I thank you for the formal courtesy Sir.

Well, to be honest Don, if you're not really schooled at this, it's not something that your label should let you handle. For the most part, here's how it works.

I take it you have recorded your album at a studio, correct? If this is the case, it would be better for the studio owner/engineer to talk to the mastering engineer in Europe and get all the details as he will know what to do. This is not something you should be involved in at all if you are not knowledgeable in this particular area. You should not have to buy any software to export master files to a mastering engineer. The studio you recorded at should handle all of this for you, but they have to get the instructions from the mastering house in order to proceed with this the correct way.

You mentioned that you are really not in the recording business but have recorded a few things for your band and yourself. This would be demo material I take it? Or is this the material you plan on releasing to your label? If you recorded the material that will be released on the label, whatever you recorded on will be enough to export the necessary files to a mastering engineer, but I can't be specific with you because each mastering guy has his own agenda.

Most times they need wave files exported out at a certain peak level that they tell you and the files must be sent out in the format (bit and sample rate) that they were recorded in. Honest, I'd be typing a lot of wasted text here if I continue because you really need to talk to the mastering person to find out what is needed from you if you recorded the stuff, or from your studio if you recorded it somewhere else. If that's the case, have your studio engineer contact the mastering engineer. They may want stems of individual tracks....tell you not to use compression or limiting on the master buss, don't do fade ins or fade outs...stuff like that. That's really the best general information I can give you without knowing what the mastering guy in Europe will want. So talk to him before you stress yourself out on this. LOL! Good luck!