Need help with compressors.

[damo maunders]

Greetings fellow audiophiles, this is my first post on Recording Review.
My post is in regards to hardware I wish to be purchasing soon, but want to get some opinions on what I should do.

Here is my story. (Im sorry if its too long and hard to understand!!!)

My current setup is a Digi 003 Rack (which can take 8 analog inputs) with Pro Tools LE Software, an IMac with a 2.4 Ghz Processor and a pair of Yamaha HS 80M Monitors. Its by no means a pro setup, but im proud of and have faith in my equipment.

Up until now i have been using my setup to edit mixes I have done at University, but now that is over, I want to setup a recording solution.

Recording that i have done on my setup has been done straight into the 003, so no compression on recording, which results in a very dynamic signal.
So firstly I want to buy a compressor. I was considering the DBX Quad comp. Ive heard its an ok compressor with 4 "sections" of compression (sorry about the terminology).
So could a possible scenario involve me simply running 4 mics straight into the 4 inputs on the quad comp, then the 4 outputs of the quad comp into 4 inputs on my 003?
Or would I need a Pre-amp somewhere in the path? (Keeping in mind the first 4 inputs of the 003 are fitted with focusrite pre's???).

So if my quad comp idea would work, would it be a good idea to buy 2 quad comps, thus having independant compression for each 8 analog inputs of my 003?

What I want out of all of this is to be able to multitrack 8 of my analog signals with independant compression. Or is there going to need to be pre's somewhere along the way?

Any advice or thoughts on this would be very helpful as i want to be buying very soon but dont want to spend my money on something that is not right for what i need.

Thanks in advance,
Damo

[Charlie_M]

Damo,

Welcome.

What are you planning to record that you need 8 channels of compression for?

Don't get me wrong I love to play with hardware of any and all kinds just for fun and learning. But.... it sounds like you may benefit from trying to record some of these highly dynamic signals first without the compression on the way in, and then play with the compression plug ins on protools. The BF76 (compressor plug in) is pretty damn great. Has a lot of character to my ears. And you can run one on each channel without having to buy 8. I think it would be hard to afford 8 comps with as much character as that BF76 has. Try that for a while and see what you think. protools also ships with a much "cleaner" less character-laden comp but I forgot the name of it... comp3 or something like that. Try those for a while and see what you think.

I'm not trying to talk you out of buying comps. I LOVE to piss away money on gear I don't 100% need (I really do). But even for me it is hard to imagine a scenario where buying 8 of the same comp would be the right thing. There are so many choices out there. I think it will be good to play with those two software comps for a while, then consider hardware later. If you HAVE to go buy one now... do yourself a favor and just buy one. I doubt very much you'll end up happy with 8 channels of the same exact compressor.

Charlie

[damo maunders]

Thanks Charlie M for the quick reply!
I just wanted to clear up what i meant about my 8 channels of compression.
What I am thinking about buying is a dbx quad compressor, which im pretty sure is a "4 in 1" compressor. So the one unit can do 4 channels. So 2 units could do 8 channels. I thought this would be helpful for recording things like drums. Individual compression for the kik, snr, hats, toms and oh's.
So maybe just the one unit would do for now i guess :P.

And as goes for just compressing after I record, ive never had much luck with that. When i go to compress afterwards, instead of getting a good strong signal on a guitar, i just end up clipping all over the place.

So I suppose its time for a browse back through all my old lecture notes!!!

Once again any ideas or thoughts are welcome as I want to come to a solution very soon.

And thanks again to Charlie M!

[Charlie_M]

I see. Ya I never record drums just use samples for that. For drums you may want compression on the way in. I heard dBx is good for drums but never tried that myself. For distorted electric guitar I haven't really found that compression while tracking is the thing to make the guitar sound bigger (layering helped me more there). I do often compress e-gtr just a little on the way in but just a little. There is a fine line when you've gone too far and the dynamics are gone. Try it with a piece of music that has a loud/distorted part and a softer part. You should be able to hear when you've crossed this line and compromised the desirable dynamics with compression.

Really though for guitar if you are clipping then you are simply running it too hot into the converters. You may wish to try just brining the level down a bit so you don't clip while tracking, and then compress that nice clean signal, and then raise the gain commensurate with your compression. You may need to adjust attack so you don't clip when you turn the gain up.

I still think it's worth it to sit down and figure out exactly how many channels of compression you feel you need to have right now. If you can get by with one of those units (4 CH) that leaves you open to get other flavors later. If you needed more than 4 but could get by with 6 channels, one dBx and one FMR RNC might be a good option while keeping costs reasonable. Just a thought - there are tons of options out there...

Good luck.

Charlie

[damo maunders]

Thanks Charlie for all the help!
I think I'm on the right track now. And as goes for the FMR RNC, I should look into getting some tasty compressors instead of getting as many as I can.

I'll keep my progress posted.
Also, tomorrow ill be posting some questions about mic choices.

Till then, take care all!
Damo

[brandondrury]

Its by no means a pro setup, but im proud of and have faith in my equipment.

You'd be surprised how many pro dudes are using the same basic setup. When I began to upgrade to high end gear, I didn't find much improvement, but I did have to shift the blame for lackluster recordings from the gear to my engineering decisions. That in itself was worth the price of the gear. Of course, if a person could learn those lessons without dropping $10k+ they could crank out some great recordings with a fatter wallet.

I'm not trying to talk you out of buying comps.
I am. Read this: Don't Buy A Hardware Compressor...Unless | Home Recording Blog

Individual compression for the kik, snr, hats, toms and oh's.

I would NEVER NEVER NEVER put compression on any of these tracks without having great isolation between the drums and my studio monitors. You need to understand that compression is very tricky in that you can't just apply "compression". There are infinitely different settings that result in infinitely different results. The difference between an attack time of 2ms and 10ms is HUGE on drums. If you don't have extreme isolation from the source, I'd give up the idea of compressing drums on the way in. I certainly do not. If I had the isolation I would consider using analog compression, but I'm not sure if I'd be happy with the unit you are referring to or not. I've never used it.

And as goes for just compressing after I record, ive never had much luck with that. When i go to compress afterwards, instead of getting a good strong signal on a guitar, i just end up clipping all over the place.

If you can't set a preamp without screwing up, you will be 100% screwed with a compressor. The internet forums liars over-exagerate this need to hit digital with such a hot level. If you are clipping, you have way too much level.

I should look into getting some tasty compressors instead of getting as many as I can.

This is the route I would take. While compressors do control dynamic range, their real benefit is in the character they add. I still don't own a hardware compressor, but soon I will have one that does something exciting to the signal. I can control dynamic range with cheap plugins.

Brandon