Anyone looking forward to Sonar 8.5, the next version of Sonar?

[Danny Danzi]

Some stuff about Sonar 8.5...

I've worked with Tech Support at the Cakewalk camp on a few releases as well as being a beta tester a while back. The reason they didn't wait for this to be a REAL release is because they got a bit of flack about Sonar 8 when it came out. It was extremely buggy at first, but they got a handle on it really quick. They decided to cut everyone a break on this release because of the issues with Sonar 8. I actually helped to fix a version of Sonar 8 which was totally fixed by 8.2. Currently, 8.3 is working flawlessly for me and it's the best version of Sonar I've ever owned. I've been using their products since Cakewalk 4 which was on floppy disks.

Sonar 8.5 is really good. We managed to find a few bugs which is of course standard when something new comes out. Rest assured, they'll be fixed in the next few weeks. Sonar 8.5 leads you to believe it is an upgrade when in all actuality, it is a completely new version. So, at $99 it's a steal in all aspects honestly. For you looper guys, Matrix view is pretty slick and the new Session Drummer is really decent too. However, to me Session Drummer is pretty much an entry level drum module. It's no BFD 2 and to be honest, it doesn't sound as good as EZDrummer in my opinion. Some of the Seteven Slate drums are very cool....but believe it or not, the Ocean Way drums to me were a total let down.

As a matter of fact, I tried out their entire program with the external drive that comes with it etc. I was astonished at how bad these sounds were. Seriously....Ocean Way is supposed to be a studio that excels in drum sounds. If this is any indication of what they are capable (which the program coming in at about $800) I think it's a total waste. I hate to say that about a company....as I know they probably worked really hard on this module. But unfortunately for me, the module and the free sounds you get for Sonar are pretty bad.

There are also a few other new goodies in Sonar 8.5 that have been improved over 8.3.1. Audio snap is a little different now, yet more precise for me and V-Vocal has had a little over-haul as well. It tracks better, doesn't crash on long phrases and turns audio into midi quite well. The additional new plugins you get with 8.5 are also pretty slick.

A new percussion suite strip plugin that caters strictly to drums. You can throw it in a drum buss to handle an entire kit or use it on each drum. There is also a Vocal strip plugin that can be used in the same fashion. They have also included new verb, delay, chorus, gates, compression and a host of other cool plugs that are all low resource useasge plugins. I definitely recommend the 8.5 version. The bugs that we have found in it depend on your usage of the product. Those of you that use it like a big tape machine without all the intense little bells and whistles will not notice any issues. The issues we are currently experiencing are nothing horrible, but for some users, it can be a bit of a nuisance.

For you guys thiniking of going to a 64 bit os, I would suggest you wait a bit longer and here's why. Now, Sonar has been on the cutting edge of the 64 bit revolution for a long time. They have since added a bit bridge that allows you to use 32 bit plugins in a 64 bit environment. But here's the problem guys...some of your plugins that you know and love will NOT work on a 64 bit system and the companies that make that currently have no plans to cater to the 64 bit os campaign.

This means if you use Waves plugs, you will not be able to use them in Sonar using 64 bit. There is a whole list we have compiled, but I don't have it on this system right now. But there are quite a few plugs that will not work. Let me explain the pros and cons of the 64 bit os for you guys.

If you are like me and record music without using intense samplers and VSTi's, there is no need for you to move over to a 64 bit OS. This 64 allows you to use your ram differently and this will help guys that use massive samplers with gigs and gigs of samples loaded. You know how if we use a few of those, we have to freeze tracks to free up cpu? This is where the 64 bot OS and additional RAM allocation will make the difference. On a 64 bit system, you will no longer need to freeze as many synth tracks. This is really the only benefit of going 64 right now.

I use a dual core 3.4 rig here running XP Pro that has 4 gigs of RAM on board. XP can only see 3.5 gig unless you enable a 3 GIG switch. (which I haven't because there are pros and cons to this swtich that may not be good for everyone) My pc sees 3.1 gig of ram which has been perfect for me. I run a few intense softsynths and don't mind if I have to freeze them. I also run hudreds of pluging without freezing and have run over 100 tracks of audio at 24/48. So, if your system is configured correctly, there really isn't a need for 64 bit unless you are a sampler guy that runs massive samplers and VSTi's at all times. You know, some of those huge orchestra products that ship with like 100gigs of samples...those types of things when used mulitple times will slow us 32 bit guys down a bit. But honestly when I tell you, that's the only thing that will be helpful to you for right now. So if you are contemplating 64 bit, make sure you know whether or not you can use your favorite plugins or not. I'll load the list of plugs that are not supported so you'll know when I get a chance. Best of luck in whatever you decide and I hope you may have found this helpful.

[Metaltyme]

Originally Posted by Danny Danzi

Some stuff about Sonar 8.5...

I've worked with Tech Support at the Cakewalk camp on a few releases as well as being a beta tester a while back. The reason they didn't wait for this to be a REAL release is because they got a bit of flack about Sonar 8 when it came out. It was extremely buggy at first, but they got a handle on it really quick. They decided to cut everyone a break on this release because of the issues with Sonar 8. I actually helped to fix a version of Sonar 8 which was totally fixed by 8.2. Currently, 8.3 is working flawlessly for me and it's the best version of Sonar I've ever owned. I've been using their products since Cakewalk 4 which was on floppy disks.

Sonar 8.5 is really good. We managed to find a few bugs which is of course standard when something new comes out. Rest assured, they'll be fixed in the next few weeks. Sonar 8.5 leads you to believe it is an upgrade when in all actuality, it is a completely new version. So, at $99 it's a steal in all aspects honestly. For you looper guys, Matrix view is pretty slick and the new Session Drummer is really decent too. However, to me Session Drummer is pretty much an entry level drum module. It's no BFD 2 and to be honest, it doesn't sound as good as EZDrummer in my opinion. Some of the Seteven Slate drums are very cool....but believe it or not, the Ocean Way drums to me were a total let down.

As a matter of fact, I tried out their entire program with the external drive that comes with it etc. I was astonished at how bad these sounds were. Seriously....Ocean Way is supposed to be a studio that excels in drum sounds. If this is any indication of what they are capable (which the program coming in at about $800) I think it's a total waste. I hate to say that about a company....as I know they probably worked really hard on this module. But unfortunately for me, the module and the free sounds you get for Sonar are pretty bad.

There are also a few other new goodies in Sonar 8.5 that have been improved over 8.3.1. Audio snap is a little different now, yet more precise for me and V-Vocal has had a little over-haul as well. It tracks better, doesn't crash on long phrases and turns audio into midi quite well. The additional new plugins you get with 8.5 are also pretty slick.

A new percussion suite strip plugin that caters strictly to drums. You can throw it in a drum buss to handle an entire kit or use it on each drum. There is also a Vocal strip plugin that can be used in the same fashion. They have also included new verb, delay, chorus, gates, compression and a host of other cool plugs that are all low resource useasge plugins. I definitely recommend the 8.5 version. The bugs that we have found in it depend on your usage of the product. Those of you that use it like a big tape machine without all the intense little bells and whistles will not notice any issues. The issues we are currently experiencing are nothing horrible, but for some users, it can be a bit of a nuisance.

For you guys thiniking of going to a 64 bit os, I would suggest you wait a bit longer and here's why. Now, Sonar has been on the cutting edge of the 64 bit revolution for a long time. They have since added a bit bridge that allows you to use 32 bit plugins in a 64 bit environment. But here's the problem guys...some of your plugins that you know and love will NOT work on a 64 bit system and the companies that make that currently have no plans to cater to the 64 bit os campaign.

This means if you use Waves plugs, you will not be able to use them in Sonar using 64 bit. There is a whole list we have compiled, but I don't have it on this system right now. But there are quite a few plugs that will not work. Let me explain the pros and cons of the 64 bit os for you guys.

If you are like me and record music without using intense samplers and VSTi's, there is no need for you to move over to a 64 bit OS. This 64 allows you to use your ram differently and this will help guys that use massive samplers with gigs and gigs of samples loaded. You know how if we use a few of those, we have to freeze tracks to free up cpu? This is where the 64 bot OS and additional RAM allocation will make the difference. On a 64 bit system, you will no longer need to freeze as many synth tracks. This is really the only benefit of going 64 right now.

I use a dual core 3.4 rig here running XP Pro that has 4 gigs of RAM on board. XP can only see 3.5 gig unless you enable a 3 GIG switch. (which I haven't because there are pros and cons to this swtich that may not be good for everyone) My pc sees 3.1 gig of ram which has been perfect for me. I run a few intense softsynths and don't mind if I have to freeze them. I also run hudreds of pluging without freezing and have run over 100 tracks of audio at 24/48. So, if your system is configured correctly, there really isn't a need for 64 bit unless you are a sampler guy that runs massive samplers and VSTi's at all times. You know, some of those huge orchestra products that ship with like 100gigs of samples...those types of things when used mulitple times will slow us 32 bit guys down a bit. But honestly when I tell you, that's the only thing that will be helpful to you for right now. So if you are contemplating 64 bit, make sure you know whether or not you can use your favorite plugins or not. I'll load the list of plugs that are not supported so you'll know when I get a chance. Best of luck in whatever you decide and I hope you may have found this helpful.

Hey man, thanks a lot for taking the time out to let us in on your insight. I really appreciate it. It gives me a good heads-up on what to expect. Thanks again dude!

[Danny Danzi]

Originally Posted by Metaltyme

Hey man, thanks a lot for taking the time out to let us in on your insight. I really appreciate it. It gives me a good heads-up on what to expect. Thanks again dude!

You're most welcome! Hopefully I can help out you guys that are using Sonar as well. There are quite a few lil tricks and tweaks I can share with you as well. So feel free to ask away.

[Metaltyme]

Originally Posted by Danny Danzi

You're most welcome! Hopefully I can help out you guys that are using Sonar as well. There are quite a few lil tricks and tweaks I can share with you as well. So feel free to ask away.

Thanks man...I'll be cooking up some questions for you that ask how you'd might approach certain tasks that I've been wanting to accomplish. You rock. Cheers!

[awaken1]

I echo that!! Thanks for the in depth info.. MUCH appriciated..your set up sounds pretty much like mine.. and for the same reasons I went XP pro 32..

[Danny Danzi]

This is the current list of plugs that will NOT work using a 64 bit OS as of right now.

01- UAD: Universal Audio | Contact

02- Toontrack: http://www.toontrack.com/contact.asp
.
03- Celemony: celemony_ :: Contact

04- Kjaerhus: Kjaerhus Audio - Professional Audio Plug-ins

05- XLN: XLN Audio

06- IK Multimedia: IK Multimedia

07- Waves: Wavesupport | Contact Waves

08- Propellerheads (Feature Request Forum): http://www.propellerheads.se/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=7

09- Finale: Contacts - MakeMusic Finale

10- Sonnox: Sonnox Support

11- Overloud: Overloud Support - PROFESSIONAL AUDIO TOOLS --- Overloud Contacts » Contact Us - PROFESSIONAL AUDIO TOOLS

12- PSP Audioware: PSPaudioware.com: audio processor & effect plug-ins VST, AudioUnit, RTAS

13- URS: Unique Recording Software

14- Softube: Softube

15- Native Instruments: NATIVE INSTRUMENTS : HTML : COMPANY : Contact NI

16- AbbeyRoad Plugins: Abbey Road Plug-ins - Technical Assistance

17- Brainworx: support@brainworx-music.de --- MS-Mastering Tools by Brainworx-Media

[fHumble fHingaz]

If you purchased 8 or 8 PE prior to 7-01-09, the 8.5 upgrade is not available for "free".

Yeah, this really annoyed me! I missed out by a matter of weeks. I had just purchased the version 8 upgrade from version 7 when I got emails telling me that if I purchased it NOW (then) I would get the next upgrade free. Marketing sucks!

[awaken1]

Yes, it is quite annoying! After I went and checked out all the chaos going down on the cakewalk forums regarding 8.5 download, I decided it wasn't worth the headache or frustration others were obviously going through..I wrote them twice about it, and called twice and have heard nothing from them..I was planning on upgrading to PE but that is in the can now do to their lack of proper C.S. So now I'm looking at maybe purchasing and learning a new daw software.

You would think the ones who first jumped off the bridge without looking would also be entitled to a free upgrade..I imagine they will probably lose a few jumpers over this..
I know they lost one.

[Danny Danzi]

I dunno awaken, I really wonder about some of those people complaining if they aren't Cubase or Pro Tools users trying to just cause issues on a Sonar forum. I have NEVER had any issues with CS or TS and I've been a user since Cake 4 on diskettes. I have been given my own TS dude that I talk to weekly as a friend now as well as my goto guy for any issues. I have no idea why I would be considered so special as to receive this type of treatment.

I had a small issue with my 8.5 download that was remedied in about 35 minutes by CS, and have used them in the past without failure. As far as the price updates etc, I think anyone bashing on that is being a bit unfair really. If you decided to wait and missed the chance, that is not the companies fault. I update when they come up each time. Not everyone can do that nor is it something that needs to be done by everyone, but I enjoy it.

I had a bit of an issue with Sonar when I was a beta tester years ago. I stopped using their stuff and decided to try again with Sonar 5 on a new pc as I had heard they got their act together. The update price for me missing several issues of Sonar was STILL more than fair and under $300 dollars which is pretty awesome for what this software is capable of doing.

Some people read the bug reports and decide not to upgrade for those reasons. I would tell those people to stop reading that stuff and buying into it. Most of the guys complaining of bugs and issues are either guys that use 100% of the program's options, or dudes that are causing trouble. Not every bug will effect you the way YOU use the program. I like to consider myself a pretty advanced Sonar user, but because of the way I use the program, I may use 60% of what it can do in all actuality.

So the guy that uses loops or other Sonar functions that I do not use, may have issues that I don't. Or, there mey be plugins or softsynths that are crashing that I don't use. That would not stop me from upgrading to the next version.

All of the above said, if you have personally received bad service from CS or TS, I completely understand your reasons and feel bad for anyone that has any legit gripes. However, they have went out of their way for me and my issues have been pretty petty for the most part. They've made me feel like I was the only customer they had...which is pretty high praise. I don't give out praises easily unless they are earned. To me, with my treatment since being a Sonar customer, I have nothing bad to say about them at all other than sometimes I feel they may rush their releases a bit each year. Good luck with whatever DAW you choose.

[TonyB]

Originally Posted by Metaltyme

It looks pretty cool I guess.

It does come with Session Drummer 3, which includes one of the Ocean Way kits as well as coming with the Steven Slate-modeled Zepp kit (along with a slew of Cakewalk's own newly recorded multi-samples, both acoustic and electronic). It has a vocal strip plugin and a percussion strip plugin that seem pretty useful. It's got a few tweaks under the hood to make for further efficiency. It's got a new version of audiosnap that's supposed to have a very much improved GUI. The media browser has been revamped to accomodate navigation more freely and conveniently for project file management. It's got new MIDI features which are making it comparable to FL Studio's versatility, yet with all its DAW-ish capabilities still intact and becoming even more robust to boot. It's only $99 for Producer Edition upgraders. They have Elite upgrade packages that come with additional 3rd-party support that seems pretty snazzy. With the not-yet-released Guitar Rig 4 PRO, Sonar 8.5 Producer price is $199, the value (bang for buck) seems bursting at the seems. 8.5 has all that 8 has, but substantially more stuff and under-the-hood improvements. I guess Cakewalk decided that there still wasn't enough content in this new version to warrant calling it Sonar 9, but I gotta say, I wouldn't have known the difference. Is anyone else out there stoked about this, or are you disappointed? I was on the fence about it for a little while, but now, I'm starting to get the G.A.S. for this. What say you guys?

Cheers,

Great rundown. I'll be upgrading shortly.

A few days ago Cakewalk sent me an email explaining why 8.5 and 9.0.

I haven't gotten around to reading the rationale yet.