How about a nice W A R M cup of PRESETS?

[Heinrich Kollner]

Hey I was just wondering if anyone (including Brandon) of you will like the idea of having a preset section here on recordingReview? this includes peavey revalver MKIII, Guitar rig 2 and 3 or any other plugin's presets. almost like Guitarampmodeling.com?

I will like the idea of trading out my presets....Will you?

[brandondrury]

To be honest, I hate just about everything about presets. The only exception are those really weird plugins (Waves Enigma comes to mind) that do way more than you'd expect and need their possibilities illustrated just so you are aware of what a unit can do.

When I swithed from Vegas to Cubase SX3 I lost every preset for ever plugin I had. It was the greatest moment in my life a an audio engineer. I had to actually learn how to use my plugins. I'm a 50x audio engineer today for it.

Now the guitar thing is a bit different than setting a compressor or whatever. While I do have concerns with losing originality, I wouldn't have minded having drum tuning presets on my last recording.

If you get enough people interested in this one, I'll find a place for it somewhere.

Brandon

[whiterabbit_the]

I'm one of those opposed to presets, but I can recall the day I first used Waves C4...I understood compression usage, but didn't really have any idea of where to start plugin wise, versus rackmount.

Currently, I try to keep everything as dry as possible because I like that raw in your face sound, but I could see where this could help others and maybe give inspiration to others.

--Aaron

[Heinrich Kollner]

I'm one of those opposed to presets, but I can recall the day I first used Waves C4...I understood compression usage, but didn't really have any idea of where to start plugin wise, versus rackmount.

Currently, I try to keep everything as dry as possible because I like that raw in your face sound, but I could see where this could help others and maybe give inspiration to others.

Not everyone has got expensive equipment and not everyone has got the knowledge on how certain plugins work.

I think its a way to share each others creativity.
I'd like to be of help to someone with very limited knowledge of plugins and give them some advice and presets so that they can use that plugin and actually learn from that like what settings i used and for what reasons.

and not everyone has got access to expensive guitar amps and mics, so i think it would be nice to help some one with less experience and less equipment out with cool guitar presets for revaler MKIII, guitar rig 2 and 3, amplitude, waves gtr3 ect. that has got good tone and is usable in songs, i think it opens up for alot more possibilities for beginners

[whiterabbit_the]

That's another way of putting it, haha. I was using Waves C4 as an example

--Aaron

[Vulconizer]

I'd like to be of help to someone with very limited knowledge of plugins and give them some advice and presets so that they can use that plugin and actually learn from that like what settings i used and for what reasons.

Good idea in theory, but the " for what reasons " part is the most important aspect, I think.

How would you impart your reasons for coming to the desired settings in your presets? If you can do that, then would there really be a need for the preset?

I understand the get-up-and-running-a.s.a.p. idea behind it, and it's actually real cool.

[marns45]

Personally, when it comes to guitar amp software, I never use presets. But that is because I am a guitar player, and I generally know how to get the sounds I want. When it comes to other plug ins, such as soft synths like FM8 and B4II, I have no idea really how to work them, so I rely heavily on the presets, find something I like then tweak it until I get the sound I was hoping for.

As a beginner, these presets are great because they get you at least part of the way to the sound you are looking for, as opposed to hopelessly searching the dials and buttons in an attempt to figure out what you are doing.

Hence, I would like to put in my vote for a preset section, especially when it comes to virtual instruments and the like.

[brandondrury]

I think its a way to share each others creativity.

That's an interesting perspective because in my experience presets have done little more than killed creativity.

and not everyone has got access to expensive guitar amps and mics, so i think it would be nice to help some one with less experience and less equipment out with cool guitar presets for revaler MKIII, guitar rig 2 and 3, amplitude, waves gtr3 ect.

I don't entirely disagree, but how a person sets their guitar is a personal thing. Zakk Wylde is always immediately identifiable. So is Slash, Eddie Van Halen, etc. I do have worries that we lose some of that individuality.

More importantly, why would you want my presets? Revalver MK3 is the first really good emulator I've heard. This takes 90% of the engineering skill out of the picture. Now it's just an issue of tweaking the amp to sound like what you like. A fear of lack of fidelity is tossed right out the window because that thing just sounds good.

There is a scary undertone to this thinking that there is a "best" guitar sound. It scares the shit out of me to be honest, because it's extremely destructive. Just like on Heinrich's "guitar sound" thread in Recording Reviews I have a feeling there will be all sorts of people getting way to anal about things that are supposed to be part of a musicians individuality. There is always a line we have to cross with audio engineering. I think there are some things that fairly objective. Any instrument that hurts should be dealt with. I always say that if the recording hurts, it gets an automatic F. However, I think we are gonna run into problems where a guy uses a Marshall style sound and a Boogie fan tells him it sucks because it's not a Boogie.

I also see limitations to presets because of different guitars being used, different arrangements, and different tracks underneath those guitars. (That's why there is still 10% engineering left).

With that said, once again, if there is enough interest I'll figure out a place to put it. I just can't think of a reason why I would want to download someone else's presets. It's not about skill, knowledge, or anything like that. I just prefer to salt my meat and potatoes myself.

Brandon

[brandondrury]

I was using Waves C4 as an example

That's another thing. Learning how to work a multi-band compressor of all things (which is NOTHING like a standard compressor) is REALLY tough to get used to in the beginning. Most people don't even know what it does.

There are a zillion retarded guitar players who know what gain, lows, mids, and highs do. In the past the problem was the limitations of the gear itself. Line 6 Spyder is not gonna EVER sound like a 5150, for example. Now the Revalver stuff really can sound like a 5150.

So I guess my question is what lesson can I learn that I can't easily figure out myself for 45 seconds of tweaking?

Brandon

[Heinrich Kollner]

That's an interesting perspective because in my experience presets have done little more than killed creativity.

that's true in some ways and in some ways not! I think it depends for what purpose the presets are used, but come to think of it....members requesting for presets and downloading them will get more and more lazy and will actually learn slower because everything gets done for them and they don't go through the "trail and error process".

So i don't disagree with you on that! but lets see what the other members think.

I don't entirely disagree, but how a person sets their guitar is a personal thing. Zakk Wylde is always immediately identifiable. So is Slash, Eddie Van Halen, etc. I do have worries that we lose some of that individuality.

that's very true! this is actually the creativity part

There is a scary undertone to this thinking that there is a "best" guitar sound. It scares the shit out of me to be honest, because it's extremely destructive. Just like on Heinrich's "guitar sound" thread in Recording Reviews I have a feeling there will be all sorts of people getting way to anal about things that are supposed to be part of a musicians individuality. There is always a line we have to cross with audio engineering. I think there are some things that fairly objective. Any instrument that hurts should be dealt with. I always say that if the recording hurts, it gets an automatic F. However, I think we are gonna run into problems where a guy uses a Marshall style sound and a Boogie fan tells him it sucks because it's not a Boogie.

I'm not one of those guys that disrespects someone Else's guitar tone, even if I dislike it I respect it because it's what that person like and not me!

its like One man's fun is another man's hell!

I also see limitations to presets because of different guitars being used, different arrangements, and different tracks underneath those guitars. (That's why there is still 10% engineering left).

haven't thought of that!

With that said, once again, if there is enough interest I'll figure out a place to put it. I just can't think of a reason why I would want to download someone else's presets. It's not about skill, knowledge, or anything like that. I just prefer to salt my meat and potatoes myself.

I prefer to do things myself too!

[whiterabbit_the]

Agreed...self taught through trial and error I believe is the way to go. I think that my idea actually fits in another part of the forum that already exists ("User Submitted Clips") with the tutorial to follow. The interesting thing about this is that a lot of times, I can not explain why/what I do as I do it because it is second nature to me....my ears issue instructions and my body follows without question, hahah.

It can go both ways for the creativity side, with the exception of ReValver. I believe in originality as well But, for "said" plugins, it's a little different story. One preset can sound awesome on one guitar track, but someone else could decide it's just a waste of time because it doesn't fit their needs. I would hope that the first person would take the settings and tweak a little from there to further understand why everything is set the way it is...but you never know. hahaha

My studio still rolls on without it So I'm not hurting either way

--Aaron

[drago]

Maybe not for guitar amp modeling plugins, but for other plugins I think it could be very helpful and in no way detrimental. If someone posts a compressor preset they like and says 'i like to use this when the drummer wants that harsh ringy rock sound on the snare', it gives everyone else another perspective when trying to achieve that sound. As with any preset, each use requires its own TLC but a fresh starting point would be nice to have once in a while.

[brandondrury]

I've put a bit of thought into this. It appears that presets are of value when demonstrating how to achieve something. The harsh snare is a good example. Maybe if a guitar really did sound god-like we'd all want to know how you did it. In this case, looking at the settings could be useful and a learning experience. It gets into the "how" and "why".

If we look at presets as doing the work for someone else, I think that's when we run into big problems.

Now that I'm closer to this, it sounds more doable.

Brandon

[sparqee]

As for presets making people lazy, I say let the lazy ones be lazy. Honestly, creative people are going to take advantage of resources in a creative way. Non-creative people are not. Each to their own. Preset are neither good nor evil, they are just a tool to be used or abused.

If we wanted to promote the "responsible use of presets" then perhaps this forum could supply a place for people to post their favorite presets but it would be required that the poster outline the character of the preset and describe how the various parameters affect the resulting sound as well as the kind of source material it was appropriate for. I would find this far more useful than just a zip file full of a 101 unexplained presets.

[brandondrury]

The bigger issue here is more about ethics. It's not exactly fundamentally sound to push presets from my point of view.

While maybe a HUGE stretch we could post kiddie porn here too. Some people would look. Some wouldn't. I don't think presets are that bad, but my gut doesn't like this preset business.

Making a kick ass recording and telling us how you did it is a great thing. Posting your EQ presets for a snare drum mean nothing without context.

I've got think about this one.

Brandon