How Do You Sell 30,000 Copies?

[maxpidge]

alot of bands nowadays try to play things to safe, GET IN THE VAN, playing at your local club, because you know all your "core" audience will show up won't build anything. Tour, tour, tour, don't be afraid to open for any band, if you can win over that towns headline bands crowd, they will come see you next time when you headline there. I tour manage bands, and i stay very busy because i only work with bands that are committed to survive making music for a living. check out my friends list, MySpace.com - pidge - 35 - Male - Michigan - www.myspace.com/maxpidge i've worked with these bands any many others. you work hard, you win!

[Jroye82]

I hate to say it - but all the bands I work with use myspace to their advantage. It's an insane marketing tool - It can also at the same time be an insanely huge waste of time.

You also need to get out there and play every week I think. See if you can find a show promoter in the area. We have several down here in texas that are putting big shows on once or twice a month that pull in huge crowds.

At the same time - its all about marketing to the masses if you want to sell large quantities. The masses are those 12 - 17yrd old kids. all my private students i teach..all they do in the evenings is search through purevolume and myspace and reverb nation...other sites of the like. They all want to say that they discovered and listened to a band way before they got famous.

See if you can get your Demos on a local show or college radio stations.
The more you network your tunes the better you are. maybe you have a mom and pop record store in your town? see if they'll let you sell your cd's for a piece of the pie.

Its hard work being in a band - I'd rather just make the records than have to try and sell them.

[thesilentdrummer]

cools stuff maxpige and jroyce

[brandondrury]

Even though Myspace sounds terrible, you can always tell the best recordings because of their height. This recording is TALLLL on my computer speakers!

They all want to say that they discovered and listened to a band way before they got famous.

Sounds like every A&R guy on the planet.

I'm not sure that I subscribe to the 12-17 year olds market 100%. While it's a given they are buying most of the cds, if no one older than 17 was going to live shows....well there wouldn't be any live shows. I think there is a major flaw with putting too much stock into the 12-17 year old crowd as a producer / engineer. If you sat me down and said "I'll pay $1,000,000 to produce a new record that alienates 12-17 but 22-27 years olds must love it.....I have absolutely no idea how to do it".

If the discussion is "How do we sell 2,000,000 copies?" You have to go with teens. But that is an unobtainable goal for any home recording dude with no label, distrubution, or budget to pull off without some major changes. However, selling 30,000 copies is much less difficult and can be done out of the trunk of a car. I've heard of numberous bands who have done it without a label who didn't focus on 12 year old kids. They were usually "college bands". I think Better Than Ezra is known as being the king. I think they sold like 70,000 units on their own before ever being signed. I'm not sure if this is true.

I think good music is good music in the end. I think there is a reason that 15 year olds that are listening to Zeppelin or the Beatles. I think this "play it safe" is a bigger downfall of music than any other decision the RIAA has made.

A buddy of mine (who subscribes to the "play it safe" mentality more than I do) was shocked when I read the RIAA sales numbers for The Offsprings "Smash" and Goo Goo Dolls "A Boy Named Goo". Both records are in my top 10 records of all time. Smash is a pissed off "guy" record. A Boy Named Goo had the girl pop hit "Name" (which is a great song). At least count, Smash was sitting at 13 million. A Boy Named Goo was at 2 million. There are very few "candy pop" albums in the top 100 albums of all time.

I need to look up the numbers to be specific, but I have no doubts that The Offsprings average sales per album is WAY higher than John Mayer or Beyounce. Maybe this a flaw of our modern times, but even the Roxette album with 4 huge hits on it only sold 2 million records.

Take a look at the best selling albums of all time. You'll find that none of them were predictable. Almost every one of them had no faith from the label or the label was about to pull the plug. (Star Wars was the same way. So was Pirates of the Carribean 2 and 3).

Brandon

[Phlipper]

Got to agree with you here, Brandon.
Music surely is, at the end of the day, art. If you write music specifically looking for a 'hit', then your art is compromised (I'm not saying that this is wrong, but it's down to the individual)
All of the greats were going to do what they do whether they made it or not (or at least that's how it seems). They bucked trends and refused to compromise. It could be a 'lap of the gods' thing, which could be a depressing thought for anyone hoping to 'make it'.
It seems that, while painters resign themselves to lives of poverty and hold their art as the most important part of their lives, musicians generally hope to achieve the wealth and fame of the greats that went before them. Fools gold, methinks.
I happen to know a few people from some of the 'supergroups' of yesteryear (Dire Straits, Rick Wakeman, Jethro Tull to name a few) and I have to say that none of them appear any happier for it. Some of them can't get over that they don't have now what they had then, some of them are happy enough to go back to playing bars and clubs. Some of them are trying to re-capture the old spark by reforming and touring what is, essentially, now a cabaret circuit.
Personally (although I'm not denying it'd be nice to get a modicum of success) I'm happy enough for people to hear my music, whether or not there is any financial gain in it for me. For this purpose, Myspace does the trick nicely. I can 'market' myself purely to achieve listeners, without trying to sell a thing (although, I don't suppose I rule out EVER trying to sell an album). I am always happy to send mp3's to people who request them free of charge.
I manage to play live regularly and enjoy this (although I don't perform my own stuff live). Although I enjoy writing and composing, I have yet to write something that makes me feel the same way as the songs of others do... I don't know what to draw from that really.
Boy! I guess my hour's up!! What do I owe you??

[brandondrury]

I guess my hour's up!! What do I owe you??

I'm glad, I don't get charged by the hour on this forum!!!


Well, don't get me wrong. I'm a capitalist. I have Def Leopard albums. I don't use the "art" word too much because I know too many braindead idiots who are trying touch their inner selves or whatever. I don't know what that means.

My thing is that people don't buy shit often. (It does happen, the Iphone has sold well). If you want to make music sell, make something of interest. Make something that is intense, extreme, and powerful if possible. Whether that fits into the current trend or not is up to you. I think the play it safe has worn itself thin. Even the "edgy" music that is supposed to offend people is getting kind of tired.

Personally, I want to musical equivalent of killing a baby. Anytime I watch a movie and there is a baby (especially if there is a monster or killer in the room, but also if it's a romantic comedy) I YELL KILL ....THE......BABY!!!! KILL....THE......BABY!!!! They always puss out. When a band can sonically kill a baby, they'll sell 5,000,000 units.

I happen to know a few people from some of the 'supergroups' of yesteryear (Dire Straits, Rick Wakeman, Jethro Tull to name a few) and I have to say that none of them appear any happier for it

Only really dumb people or really smart people are happy. Everyone else is screwed.

Brandon

[Phlipper]

Originally Posted by brandondrury

Personally, I want to musical equivalent of killing a baby. Anytime I watch a movie and there is a baby (especially if there is a monster or killer in the room, but also if it's a romantic comedy) I YELL KILL ....THE......BABY!!!! KILL....THE......BABY!!!! They always puss out. When a band can sonically kill a baby, they'll sell 5,000,000 units.
Brandon

Stop it. You're scaring me.

[brandondrury]

If only I could do that in a song, I'd sell 5,000,000 units.

[mrabassist]

To me, its all about label support. A band that self manages a tour usually doesnt do as well as a band that has managers and promoters pushing their tour. A band that records a cd at home usually doesnt have the results of a band that records at a studio. A band that is left to push their own cd is definatly not going to do as well as a band that has a label pushing.

Classic example
My band in highschool was in constent competiton with one other band in the area. We drew crowds of 200-500. They drew crowds of 20-80. We were equally good, but we knew more people.

To push that to label terms, if everyone in the band pulls out their cell phones, they have maybe a combined 1100 people they know, and thats family and non music lovers included. A label manager pulls out his phone (figuratively) and he has atleast that many people in every major city in every state.

Cater to your fans. Of course. Duh. Put on amazing shows and write amazing songs. Have fun. But get the attention of labels who are going to push it. (for modern music scene guys, and i can talk cause i know them, do the Forever The Sickest Kids thing where you get over a million plays on myspace before your first show)

Thats an extreme example but really. What all bands that go to phase 3, as i see it, in touring and professionalism is that they first play at home, then start to tour, then start to go to towns where they dont know anyone, but they certainly know the band. That doesnt happen because friends call friends. It happens cause labels push records. Thats why today bands are being suprised when their hometown shows are smaller then ones they play on the opposite coast.

Point is, company support beats friends. Yes it is technically selling out. Its not that bad though.

[1 M.I.C]

i think a hometown buzz can be really important tho, regardless of were you live. i mean for anyone, maybe more-so artists, its a good feeling i think, when you see someone who comes from the same place as you on the tv, or hear them on the radio, or read about them in a magazine. from an artists standpoint, its like, yeah that could be me soon. and from a listeners standpoint, its that leval of connection that helps increase their support for that artists or band.

i mean i have a song right now, that everyone we show it to loves, they tell us how we should get it on the radio, send it out as a demo or something, whatever they can think of. unfortuantly (im a rapper) its not on a original beat, its a commercial beat, so radio play isnt an option. but i can jus see in the people on this side of time, how they would actually be excited if it was on the radio, because its like were getting our name out, and we hang out at the same spots they do. its good to know that its almost like a REAL PERSON is on the radio, rather then a celeberty who you have almost no connection with.

so from my standpoint ,i think its very important to get the support of your city behind you, because those are the ones who could become very dedicated fans.