VSTi in Cubase

[mojo69]

I'm downloading MIDI song files into Cubase VST 5.1/32 and using Roland Virtual Sound Canvas as a VST. Each time I set up the instrument patch another patch plays the MIDI notes when the MIDI song file starts to play. I'm setting up the patch in the edit section of the VST instruments rack.

Can't understand why the chosen patch won't play? I can get it to sound when I edit the rack when the song is playing but if I set it up before hitting play - another patch plays the MIDI file!

[richiebee]

Are there program change messages in each channels MIDI data? You can check by opening them up in the List Editor.

A program change message will make it sound with the GM patch that the creator intended. The Virtual Sound Canvas should be GM compatible. If you want to use different patches, you either need to change the program change messages in the List Editor, or delete them completely and set them on the VI itself (if that's an option).

Rich

[garww]

Along with the Volume sysex in each MIDI track, there is the Instrument sysex. And sometimes there are several sysex changes in each track.

If I am actually working on a composed MIDI file, I have to save a .mid with the sysex I desire.

[garww]

Ya, I've already posted my MIDI event list regarding your Volume question. It's the same for the instrument sysex. As RB implies, you will eventually settle on a workflow for these issues after you decide the track has useful programming - and, that's not always the case as you might be able to find a better one. Many of my MIDI are 5-6 deep from different performers and I think it pays to look around for a good work.

[mojo69]

The same is happening when I load Slayer 2 as a VST.

However, when I use Groove Agent on track 10 everything is fine!

Could you guys explain the programme change messages in List Editor and how to correct them either in List Edit or in the chosen VSTi. I'm a novice regarding MIDI.

Cheers

[garww]

I don't really know that much about VSTi for MIDI. I use what works for me, but they don't often replace my samples. Off-hand, it seems each may choose what sysex it wants to use - maybe there is a set-up screen for them, but I'm not finding it very often. The few Native Instrument soft synths I have are pretty good.

In the "Event" screen I posted from my application, I just highlight the parameter line and hit the delete key. You will have to make mental notes on how the VSTi work. It can be pretty smooth sailing once you get in a pattern.

I make file directories based on what playback device I compose on, and VSTi is essentially a playback device. So, I might have a directory named to suggest I used a Merlin soundfont and (NI)DX7. So, the .mid file here is not my archive copy and I can pretty much trash it without any consequence.

[garww]

Oh !! I don't know much about GS, but the sysex may be different for some of these important parameters. Keep that in mind if the VSTi doesn't say it supports GS.

[mojo69]

I know you guys are trying to help me and I appreciate it. But I don't understand what you wrote Richie:

'you either need to change the program change messages in the List Editor, or delete them completely and set them on the VI itself (if that's an option).'

What's a program message?

How do I change or delete them in List Editor? I'm reading the manual so will be able to suss it out if you can clarify it some more.

How do I set program messages on a VSTi?

S**t I'm panicking now!

[mojo69]

Basically, I know how to set up my VSTis to play back MIDI composed on my keyboard. But I need to learn how to set up my VSTis to playback the MIDI files I'm importing in to Cubase.

At the end of the day what I'm trying to achieve is the BEST sound quality I can get when playing the downloaded MIDI files - ie NOT GM Wavetable!

[richiebee]

Sysex is not intended to be used to send short data chunks like volume changes or patch changes, nor is it intended for real time performance. It is usually used to send messages for a specific device (hence the name SYStem EXclusive, which is where SYSEX comes from) and because it usually contains a lot of information, gets broadcast at the start of your MIDI file rather than during it, when it can cause hiccups in the data flow.

Patch changes have their own handler (Program Change), and Volume, Pan etc have their own handlers (both Control Change messages... 7 and 10 respectively).

MIDI has several levels of specifications (MIDI, General MIDI, GS, XG). It's important to understand where your sound sources fit into this. GM is the most basic standard, but is also the most restrictive. It's way too restrictive for really serious sequencing, but does the job for creating really widely compatible files. GS is Roland specific and XG is Yamaha specific. Neither one is really widely used because they cease to have the advantage of General MIDI compatibility, and are still restrictive.

Most of our realistic sound sources these days are way too complicated to follow such a tightly defined specification such as GM, GS or XG. Luckily, these days, if you stay in the box, recalling patches in your sound sources is easy. It wasn't always this way!!!