Getting Started With Drum Sequencing?

[brandondrury]

Hey dudes,

I've started my first project with fully midi sequenced drums (with everything else being tracked the old fashion way with microphones). Anyway, my midi drum programming skills are 0 right now. I'm especially clueless when it comes to fills.

I don't have the cash to buy a midi drum kit so the notion of having a real drummer play is out. I'm gonna have to do this one with a mouse (unless I have some other option I haven't thought of.

What's the fastest way to become a bad ass at sequencing drums with a mouse? Any recommended videos, books, etc on this?

Brandon

[dach]

Just jump in.... just make sure the part/beat grooves/pushes-pulls accordingly and depending on your drum sounds, you may need to exaggerate the dynamics to make it more realistic.

concentrate on getting 2 then 4 bars to work the you can copy/paste. one you track to that, then you can go back and change some things to add life and add fills.

When you track everything yourself, after you've gotten the song structure identified and built by copying and pasting, you sort of have to jump around instruments a couple of bars at a time to simulate a real band playing live... this is in order to make the cut breathe... static stuff just doesn't get it unless you have to crank cuts out.. a good example is if the bass doesn't push before the chorus, your guitar track probably won't either....punch in, edit in or whatever a couple of measures at a time.... unfortunately it works better this way than doing one instrument at a time... once everything is happening, take notes of the sounds the cut really needs, learn each part instinctively... and then re-track your live instruments... properly

[brandondrury]

Interesting.

I'm used to a world of not very tight playing, so the idea of getting everything "on" really intrigues me quite a bit. I understand that dance music style rythms do get fatiquing. Interesting.

As Fletcher says, "Drum tuning is like eating pussy. You've just got to dive in face first".
Of course, in this case, it's drum sequencing.

Brandon

[guitar junkie]

Ableton Live is the best software i have used for this work, has some great videos and lessons on drum patterns and the like very nice stuff!

got a great sample player too, i only have the lite version!

which for the most part only means that i have a track limit of like four audio tracks and something else midi...

big deal just program them in there and render them to REAPER or Tracktion depending on which machine i run....

REAPER is getting really nice right now the shear power it has is really turning heads!

[dach]

I don't know... any songs I like to listen to, no matter the groove, the players are "ON"... not necessarily exact, but doing their part in, on and around the beat (wherever that may be) to create the solid groove/pulse of the song... It can be a little sloppy and that can add thickness, but it's a feel thing. It usually starts with the drums and bass as foundation.... don't overthink it. Just do it... and when you are done reveling in your latest masterpiece, don't forget to take a critical look at it and see where it can be improved performance wise...

[brandondrury]

Ableton Live is the best software i have used for this work, has some great videos and lessons on drum patterns and the like very nice stuff!

I downloaded a demo.? Wow!? It looks NOTHING like any recording program I've ever used.? I didn't know how to do anything!? Normally, there's a track that you can arm or add effects to.? I was totally clueless.? I spent 2 minutes pushing buttons and that was the extent of it.? I may need to give it a more serious look.


Back to sequencing timing variation

Out of curiosity, are the modern techno guys who do The Matrix movies and such doing this sort of thing, too?? ?Here's why I ask.? When I listen to something with heavy sequencing from 20 years ago, like New Order, for example, I hear a lot of "stiffness".?

I just watched an online video talking about simply varying the velocity of certain drums helps make it sound a lot more like we what we are used to hearing and that may be why the New Order drums sound so "stiff".

While I don't remember the last time (or if I have ever) sat down to listen to modern techno, but while watching the 3rd Matrix movie last week, I didn't notice this same "stiffness".? I may not have noticed because I was watching movie and not doing molecular music biology.

I guess, I'm asking if adding the push/pull concept in slight amounts of relevant for all styles.

Brandon

[guitar junkie]

keep at Ableton it really has some great stuff to work with there, go back and hit the tab key on your keyboard it changes things up a little

also watch the videos they have on the website for a little more understanding of the product.

[brandondrury]

Cool. Will do!

Brandno

[dach]

Originally Posted by brandondrury

Out of curiosity, are the modern techno guys who do The Matrix movies and such doing this sort of thing, too?? ?Here's why I ask.? When I listen to something with heavy sequencing from 20 years ago, like New Order, for example, I hear a lot of "stiffness".?

Stiffness was part of the new sound. It was a big departure from the funk type rhythms that dominated. The only sequencing back then was on Atari & maybe Commodore computers. I used to us a software called "Masterpiece" and a Roland SBX40 slaved to the Sony 1/2" video dubs to trigger sound Effects for film from samplers... what a nightmare! Before Macs, PC's & Adats and better timecode units, the absolute most I ever accomplished in a 12 hour period was about 1 to 2 minutes worth of effects per day... better than dumping from tape to tape though....

I just watched an online video talking about simply varying the velocity of certain drums helps make it sound a lot more like we what we are used to hearing and that may be why the New Order drums sound so "stiff".

timing is one thing, but to groove, the dynamics & accents need to be there as well... when it's right, it's usually transparent.... you only really notice it when it's not.... much harder to do than it sounds... if it feels in time but the mix isn't really going well, it may be the dynamics...

I guess, I'm asking if adding the push/pull concept in slight amounts of relevant for all styles.

I think so.... except when you want your music quantized like New Order...

[russv99]

One way of improving midi drum programming (apart from sitting in front of a real drum kit with a drummer) is to look at lessons on the web for would-be drummers. These explain the contruction of basic beat types and of course these can be applied to midi drum kits. They won't turn you into Billy Cobham but it's a good place to start.

Here are some -

Drum Beats - Rock Drumming

Online drumset lessons (with video): DRUM SET / BASIC DANCE BEATS.

How To Play Drums & How-To Guide