Resonators?

[TAlderson]

So, last friday I opened for a Sarah Lee Guthrie and Johnny Irion, a folk/country duo (who were actually quite good!), but I kind of fell in love with the sound of the resonator guitar he had, and so I was wondering if any of you played/knew a good starter instrument or had any tips or something...

Thanks,

-Tyler

[brandondrury]

Are these the guitars made out of metal that weigh 10x more than a regular acoustic guitar?

Brandon

[TAlderson]

Yeah.

-Tyler

[brandondrury]

Well, that shows you how much I know about resonators. I picked one up once. I thought it was pretty cool. I wish I could be of help. I don't get stumped too often. (Except when you keep thinking of new instruments to play). ;D

Brandon

[phangeaux]

Originally Posted by TAlderson

.....but I kind of fell in love with the sound of the resonator guitar he had, and so I was wondering if any of you played/knew a good starter instrument or had any tips or something...

Thanks,

-Tyler

Hi Tyler,

I have a 1997 Continental Tricone (style 2 which means that it has the Rose engraving) nickle plated bell brass body, hand made and signed by the maker, made in Germany. As far as I can tell from all of the research I did, this is the next best thing to a National tricone. They listed new for about $2600 at the time and I got this one used for $1500 and every penny of that was exceedingly well spent in my view. This is a fine instrument.

Resonator guitars were invented in the 1920s and were designed to amplify the guitar sound so they could be heard above other instruments like pianos, drums etc., by using resonator cones. They are an extraordinary instrument, built very strong to accommodate heavier guage strings (increased tension) and often set up to play slide, either bottleneck or lapstyle, but they sound great for fingerstyle and flat picking as well. They are made to get volume so go for it and put some energy into those strings, that is where they sound the best in my opinion. They have incredible sustain too.

Of 15 guitars that I have, this is the best; best made and best quality, I love it. It never ever ceases to amaze me. It has taken a few years to get used to playing it. It was awkward at first due to the heavy body and it's slipperyness (shiney plating) so I had to learn how to hold it a bit differently.

I play mostly bottleneck slide with it in alternate tunings. String guages are important here and probably the factory set-ups you will find are using medium guage strings like 12 or 13 to 56. I think I am using 15-60 or something like that, all of the strings heavier than medium and they do make resonater string sets or you can chose which guages you like best for each string. This may depend upon what tunings you use as a guage may need to get heavier depending upon how much the tuning of that string is dropped.

The heavier guages sound better and are better for slide and the stuff I play which is blues mostly.

National was the pioneer of resonator guitars and held many, or most of the patents. The Dobro brothers worked (as engineers designers?) there and later formed a company making 'Dobro' guitars (wood body resos) which I think was later bought out by Gibson. There were some other key designers there also, including George Beauchamp who later invented the electric guitar pick-up and first electric guitar prototype called 'the pancake' See this link:

http://www.npr.org/programs/morning/...lectricguitar/


I think that originally they (resonators) were mostly used for Hawaiian music which was popular in that era and then the blues guys and other guitarists picked them up.

In the early 1930's the electric guitar pick-up was invented and resonators took a back seat to the emerging popularity of the new electric guitars. However, the resonators have a unique sound and endearing qualities that some people would never part with and there has been a big resurgence in their popularity.

As far as tips and recommendations I suggest that you join Bob Brozman's acoustic IGS (International Guitar Seminars) Forum. There are lots of resonator players on that forum from all over the world with all kinds of reso guitars, lots of experts in this arena. Do searches on that site and you'll get lots of recommendations and very useful information.

There are a few die-hard loyalist National Resophanic brand people there who more or less think that if it isn't a National than it isn't worth considering- you know what I mean- like 'if it isn't a Fender then it's junk' kind of an attitude. There are alot of people there who know alot about the subject, a number of luthiers and guitar makers and people with alot of experience playing them, and shopping for them/ comparing them etc.

Most of the resonators available are copies of Nationals. Some of the best ones like mine are as good as Nationals, or too close in quality to distinguish a difference. I got lucky I think.

Sometimes guitar manufacturing is like auto manufacturing and some years or vintages of a particular model are better than other years, due to a change in manufacturing techniques for example, and even one guitar on the production line might be slightly better than the next one coming down the line, so it is good to try several out before chosing one.

I almost bought a 1932 National Style 'O' for the same amount of money ($1500) and it had lots of miles on it, so to speak, but it played BEAUTIFULLY and perfectly, a very fine instrument. I ended up chosing the Continental Tricone over that one, however.

Some people buy the less expensive reso's and then put National cones in them as an upgrade, and they claim to get much better sound quality but I think some (not all) of that percieved improvement is psychological.

The right (new) strings or going to make a difference.

I cannot think of one slide guitar resonator player in the world who is better than Bob Brozman. He is extraordinary! His Hawaiian slide with slack key backup from Ledward Kapana work will open up a whole new world of guitar sound and technical skills, its AMAZING.

Here is a webpage, where if you click on the play radio link you may hear some of Bobs better work. Some of his Hawaaian stuff with Ledward Kapana is awesome.
http://www.music.com/person/bob_broz...graphy/albums/

He travels all over the world and plays all kinds of music from other cultures and such. He is actually a music professor I think.

Here is his website which I believe has a link to the IGS acoustic guitar Forum. That is where I recommend going for advice and answers to questions about resonator guitars and playing them.

I bought Bob Brozman's 3 DVD set (4 hours) on playing bottleneck blues. It focuses alot on techniques and teaches very good techniques. These techniques are very important when playing slide guitar properly. It is not as simple as it might seem when watching someone play. There are some essential techniques such as damping both behind the slide and palm damping which are important for getting the best results for example.

Actually, Bob Brozman was a big influence on me chosing the Tricone which is what he plays mostly, rather than a single cone resonator.

Here is Bob's website, check it out (there should be a link to the IGS acoustic guitar forums there.

http://www.bobbrozman.com/

The answers to your questions would best be found at that forum.

There are other great slide players, Sam Mitchel was awesome, he died recently. Johnny Winter is pretty darned good, especially acoustic stuff, Duane Allman and Warren Haynes played alot in standard tuning, which is a good tuning for slide work although most people use alternate tunings.

Some good old timers too. I like Mississippi Fred McDowell.

I like it all really.

Only thing I can suggest is that when you try some reso's out try playing loud which I think is where they shine. Play normally I guess to. If you know some open tunings be sure to try those out like open G is a good one. DGDGBD or drop D, DADGBD. I think that the ringing qualities of open tunings are great on a reso.

The tricone has a fuller tone than a single cone and is more versatile as to styles of music that sound good on it (my opinion) and I picked it for the fuller tone and versatility. This is a guitar I'll keep forever, it's amazing.

I would like to have a single cone reso for some of the delta blues style stuff but the Tricone works quite well too.

Good Luck.

[TAlderson]

Wow, thanks, man. I'll definitely check that out!

-Tyler

[phangeaux]

I made a slight error in the historical information. The name of the brothers who formed the Dobro company is 'Dopyera'. Here is some partial information on that followed by a link to the whole article:

The name originated in 1928 when the Dopyera brothers formed the Dobro Manufacturing Company to manufacture a new resonator guitar design they called the Dobro. Dobro is both a contraction of Dopyera brothers and a word meaning good in their native Slovak language. An early company motto was Dobro means good in any language.

The Dobro was the third resonator guitar design by John Dopyera, the inventor of the resonator guitar, but the second to enter production. Unlike his earlier tricone design, the Dobro had a single resonator cone, and it was inverted, with its concave surface up. The Dobro company described this as a bowl shaped resonator.

The Dobro was louder than Dopyera's original design, the tricone, and cheaper to produce. Cost of manufacture had in Dopyera's opinion priced the resonator guitar beyond the reach of many players, and his failure to convince his fellow directors at the National String Instrument Corporation to produce a single cone version was part of his motivation for leaving.

Since National had applied for a patent on the single cone (US patent #1,896,484), Dopyera had to develop an alternative design, which he did by inverting the cone so that rather than having the strings rest on the apex of the cone as per the National method, they rested on a cast aluminum "spider" which had 8 legs sitting on the perimeter of the upside down cone (US patent #1,808,756).

It is an interesting and informative article which you might want to check out:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dobro

As a side note, I have encountered quite a few slide players that have gone to playing lapstyle with various acoustic guitars and lapsteels. It seems that there are some who claim that once you start playing that way you'll be reluctant to go back to a standard position because there is alot more that you can do on the guitar in a lapstyle position.

I don't agree with some people who think that you need a resonator to play slide. I think it sounds beautiful on a wood body guitar. Ry cooder uses a standard wood body guitar for playing slide- I think it's a Martin. He did the acoustic slide guitar soundtrack for the film 'Paris Texas' which I would describe as a sort of haunting guitar sound.

Kelly Joe Phelps from Portland Oregon plays some extraordinary acoustic slide. Great guitar playing. You really should check him out. I think he is using a Gretsch and a Gibson (acoustic guitars) on most of his work AND he plays lapstyle, primarily. There are some video clips from his DVD lessons on lapstyle slide playing at Homespun Tapes. They are beginners clips. but you might hear a little bit of his regular playing at the beginning. http://www.homespuntapes.com/

There is a blind guy who was in a movie, Jeff something... Jeff Healy? who plays electric guitar lapstyle. There areally are some advantages to that position (lapstyle), especially when playing slide.

I haven't gone to lapstyle yet but I probably will at some point. I want to get very good at the bottleneck style first.

[phangeaux]

As I mentioned in the 'Dobro' topic, both of these topics belong in the guitar player section rather than 'other instrumen6ts'\

Anyhow, Occasionally I work on Jimi Hendrix Voodoo Chile with my tricone resonator, bottleneck slide style. It is one of my favorite songs and no one can do it as well as Jimi Hendrix, of course it is his song.

I have numerous versions of the song by many different artists, even 'The String Cheese Incident' has a somewhat bluegrass style version with lots of fiddles (violins) being the main instrument and there is even a bit of accordion in the middle.

The first time I heard an acoustic resonator slide version of this song it was by Ben Harper. That version is sort of a muddy blues version typical to the old resonator blues recordings, without alot of studio refinement in other words.

Here is an acoustic slide version played on a tricone resonator (looks like a National Tricone) recorded by an Australian guitarist songwriter named Adam Hole. I don't know if he is playing this in conventional position or lapstyle

You can play it streaming or download it to your computer by right clicking and 'save as'.

What do you guys think of this stuff?

I think that the recording engineering could be alot better. Tricones have a really full tone and volume that I rarely hear come out to it's fullest in recordings. There is room for improvement, pehaps some stronger enhancement to really bring out the sound quality and volume of a tricone reso. ALSO, these guitars were designed to be PLAYED LOUD, and most people now days that I have heard play them too soft. Not me, I like to put alot of feeling into the strings and pick them hard. I can hardly wait to start recording with my tricone.

Anyhow, what do you'all think of this version of Voodoo Chile?

on edit: OOPS, that link didn't work, so try this link, just go doiwn the page to VOODOO CHILE and play it or download it:
http://axeplayer.freepgs.com/html/mo...op=MostPopular


Here is his homepage with a photo of him playing a Tricone Resonator conventional style. There are also other music samples and downloads. Pretty good website too:

Welcome To The Internet Home Page Of The Australian Guitarist/Songwriter Adam Hole

http://axeplayer.freepgs.com/html/index.php

[phangeaux]

HEY!, check out the other music on Adam Hole's site, there is some great stuff on there! other slide, resonator, electric and 12 string stuff..

Up until now I had only listened top Voodoo Chile which he had posted a link too a long time ago on one of the groups I belong to.

I have a really slow dial-up connection so it will take awhile for me to hear it all.

[phangeaux]

I noticed that the voodoo child clip is just a 1.74MB sample so I am not sure how much of it is there to hear. I picked up a 4.86MB complete version somewhere online about a year ago.

I see that he is playing a Johnson tricone which is fairly inexpensive and which has been modified (upgraded) to sound better.

I've heard better sounding resonator recordings and players but I like this acoustic version of Voodoo Child. I think it could use quite a bit more feeling and more bite to it which is what I hope to do with it. I may have to find a unique tuning- whatever it takes to get the power of the song with an acoustic resonator & slide. (may take me a year to get it worked out)

The modfications and Adam Hole's personal recording techniques for this guitar are lower on this page:

http://axeplayer.freepgs.com/html/mo...hp?name=Lounge

I don't know what tunings other people use to play this song with slide but I've been using open D mostly and have used open G and even double dropped D. Hendrix dropped down a full step and used D-G-C-F-A-D but he wasn't playing slide. Ultimately I think I am going to have to find some unusual tuning