Merry Christmas!!

[Andrew07]

Hope everybody had a great holiday. Anybody get any cool shit? I got the Charles Dye "Mix it like a record" instructional dvd which I think is pretty sweet.

[brandondrury]

Awesome dude.

You should do a review on it (or let me borrow it).

As far as Christmas is concerned, I got like 10 lbs of coffee. It should last me most of the year.

Brandon

[richiebee]

I got lots of coffee and coffee paraphernalia too. Must be a musician thing! I also got the Absynth and Kontakt tutorial DVD's. Absynth is more important to me because I have to admit, I don't understand it, and right now, I can do little else than use factory presets. I can tweak, but they always end up sounding extremely similar to the factory presets! So far I've watched about 3 hours, and I've got to say... I still can't make a decent patch. But I have learned quite a lot of things that definitely aren't in the manual, and I think if I watch it through, then watch the whole thing a second time, I'll pick up even more and be able to start. This whole thing came up because I nearly picked up a sample based synth set (Sonic Couture's Synthi) which sounds amazing... but I got to thinking that I should be able to come up with that stuff using Absynth... and here we are.

[brandondrury]

Absynth is the coolest synth on the planet. I do question the use of some of the presets, but you would be amazed at what these "questionable" presets can do to a song when used with a little taste.

We used one that sounded a lot like a chime you'd find on someone's porch. It had an enormous effect on the song.

Having said that, I spent maybe 10 minutes trying to tweak and I got nowhere. I'm not too big on editing the sounds of synths simply because I usually don't use them that often. However, it's clear that Absynth is a monstrous powerhouse.

Brandon

[Andrew07]

I've watched the Mix it like a record DVD three times now and I'm really liking it. It's pretty pricey, but for me and the way I work and learn, it's a must-have. It's strictly for mixing, and I think if you're looking more for the theory or concepts of mixing, Stav's book would be better. I'm a much more hands-on learner, and watching and hearing something is 10 times more beneficial to me than reading about it. The dvd has a TON of cheesy editing and video production shit. Also, he's using Pro Tools HD (or maybe TDM) so he has a bunch of tracks and maybe close to 100 plug-ins in the mix. He uses a couple TDM-only plug-ins, but also a wide (WIDE) variety of native plugins. Waves, URS, UAD, MCDSP, Reverbs, Delays....If you're interested in new mixing tips and techniques, this DVD offers a bunch of them. I'd type more but the jeans my girlfriend got for christmas don't fit and I think she's about to go ape-shit.

[brandondrury]

I'd type more but the jeans my girlfriend got for christmas don't fit and I think she's about to go ape-shit.

I hope this is going where my brain thinks it's going.

Now back to these DVDs. So how would you rate these things. Is your next mix going to sound better because of these DVDs? Can you raise your rates because your mixes are THAT much better? (Both of these would be in the '10 out of 10' ballpark).

[Andrew07]

Haha, I wish. It was more of a "I'm PMSing and you better tell me how pretty and skinny I am or I'm going to start throwing dishes at you"

I got some late Christmas presents from family, and I'm on a DVD tutorial-overload. I got the Charles Dye DVD and the three Secret of the Pro's Pro Tools DVD's.

The Charles Dye 'Mix it Like a Record' gets a 7.5/10. It was $130 (it was a christmas present for me, though ) and I think that's kind of too high of a price. The guy knows his stuff and he does offer a TON of tips and tricks that he uses, though. He goes step by step through everything he does and you can see and (more importantly) hear what all of the processing is doing. I found this really usefuly for ME and the way I WORK and how I LEARN. I've never watched a real mixing dude work, and this DVD was exactly that. It was incredibly useful to see and hear how he went from point A to point B. I could watch/listen and go "hey those shitty *blank* tracks sound like my shitty *blank* tracks!" By using a TON of processing he transformed those tracks into something else and they still sounded fairly shitty on their own. Once in the mix however, it sounded like a record. Very little in mixing creates THAT much change, but there were several things he did that made me go, hey that sounds kind of better! This DVD made me realize that my mixes need a lot more space and ambiance to them. The automation section of the DVD was also very cool. I'd say this DVD is for intermediate mixers who have a basic idea of mixing techniques. By watching how Charles set and routed everything, it gave me a rough idea of the kind of mixing/processing/routing I could be doing. The song he mixed was pop/rock but the techniques were sound and I'm sure would work for many genres. I gave this DVD a 7.5 because although it's very cool and provides the whole session to load into your sequencer, it's a little expensive, and the processing he uses would be difficult to replicate on a non-Pro Tools HD system. He used maybe a hundred plug-ins with probably as many tracks and plug-ins from almost every plugin company. For every mix he uses 4-6 Reverb Auxes, 4-6 Delays, a Metaflanger, Harmonizer, and a random effect. This alone would probably eat up my system usage. This DVD probably isn't best suited for dudes who don't like to really tweak mixes and fuck around with way too many plugins. That said, I'd say definetly go for picking up a used copy. For me I really enjoyed the DVD (especially since I didn't have to pay) and find it to be very useful. NO, it won't improve my mixes ten fold, but it did open my eyes to some new techniques/way of working on a mix that has the potential to improve my mixes...but like everything with recording that will take some time.


I just started watching one of the Secrets of the Pro's Pro Tools DVD's this morning, and just from what I've seen these DEFINETLY will improve my mixes. Thanks, Mom! After working with Pro Tools Le for a little over a year, I thought I had a moderate grasp on it's editing skills...but it's now apparent I don't know shit. These bad boys were around $30-40 and they have a TON of information. From only watching 20 minutes today I have a strong feeling these editing techniques will improve my mixes 10x. I'm hoping bad-ass drum editing and pitch correction = more $$$$. I would also like to make business cards that have the words "Pro Tools Wizard!" on 'em . I'll write more once I delve more into these

[brandondrury]

I just started watching one of the Secrets of the Pro's Pro Tools DVD's this morning, and just from what I've seen these DEFINETLY will improve my mixes

Interesting. Do you ever worry you are going to end up with too "sterile" of tracks? Just curious.

Brandon

[Andrew07]

Interesting. Do you ever worry you are going to end up with too "sterile" of tracks? Just curious.

Brandon

Nuh uh. I actually strive to achieve that digital super-edited kind of sound (think John Feldman and most modern pop/country). After talking with some big mixing dudes I was really amazed at how much beat detective and drum samples are used

[brandondrury]

Fair enough.

The overly edited sound is something that I fear, personally and generally strive to stay away from. That could be because I don't like that many records that were in this fashion (this could just be my age showing).

Maybe it's my dance music upbringing in the 80s, but I find that the mega quantized sound definitely has a place, but I generally hate hearing it on rock records.

I was listening to the first The Used record the other night. I love that album, but that snare sound is complete shit (in my opinion). I had a buddy in junior high school that the debatebly queer jock dudes called "Tater Tot' after staring at his weiner. I kind of think of that snare sound as being a Tater Tot snare. Of course, it's still one of my favorite post 2000 records, so I guess it's not THAT big of deal.

I have no problem with the drum samples thing. I think if it makes the music better, do it.

This whole beat detective thing intrigues me. Since I've been doing a lot of programming, I've had to spend a lot of time fucking up the tracks to make them sound "better" to my ears. The perfect quantized sound is quite horrible to me, really. But then again, I'm sure that drums I've screwed up are probably still quite "sterile" to the purist.

Brandon

[richiebee]

I'm sure you'd hate the new Melodyne plugin... you can quantize pitch and rhythm from audio sources. This must be your definition of a nightmare.



R.

[brandondrury]

It's not so much of a nitemare...I think those tools are great for catering to the insecurities of musicians....and not for making better music.

The Beatles had an out of time tamborine in one song. Wagener showed us. None of them are starving. A friend of mine worked with a real producer and they spent 13 complete days doing guitar tracks. The final results came out alright...about what I'm doing these days in my house...but I could have recorded an entire album's worth of guitars in that time...and the sales would be no different than they are now.

It does come down to sales to me...because this is, in the end, how a record is judged. A record that sales 10,000,000 copies has much great social signifiance than a record that sales 100 copies or even 1,000,000. So if a decision I've made in producing doesn't improve the listeners experience enough to make the album worth buying, it doesn't really matter.

I don't think these new magic fix it tools make records better. They just help musicians who are X good sound like they are X+1 or whatever.

I do have to admit that it is nice when time is a tight to be able to fix a few notes ....as long as the performance is inspiring.

Brandon

[richiebee]

It's not so much of a nitemare...I think those tools are great for catering to the insecurities of musicians....and not for making better music.

It's not for catering to the insecurities of musicians. Its for saving time and saving an otherwise ruined take.

No, its not for making better music. Its for making music better.

The Beatles had an out of time tamborine in one song. Wagener showed us.

I don't understand why people put so much value in what the Beatles did. Chances of you making a great hit by using the same production techniques today are pretty darn slim.

It does come down to sales to me...because this is, in the end, how a record is judged. A record that sales 10,000,000 copies has much great social signifiance than a record that sales 100 copies or even 1,000,000.

How many 10,000,000 unit albums have you produced? How many 1,000,000 unit albums have you produced? Shit, how many 10,000 unit albums have you produced? Numbers matter to those at the very top. To the rest, its about exposure of your material in the best light. Production values vary between genre's significantly. Don't get stuck in the hard rock mentality unless that's all you ever want to produce. There's more to life than guitars and drums. Stringed instruments, wind instruments and voice... they all need a level of skill to keep them playing every note in tune. Even the best performers can't always keep every note in tune.

So if a decision I've made in producing doesn't improve the listeners experience enough to make the album worth buying, it doesn't really matter.

Well, despite my comments above, I agree with you here. You're there to make the material sound as good as it can. What that means depends on the material, but the premise is the same.

I don't think these new magic fix it tools make records better. They just help musicians who are X good sound like they are X+1 or whatever.

Isn't that what you're trying to do? See above.

I do have to admit that it is nice when time is a tight to be able to fix a few notes

Of course. If you have to use it on everything, the performer shouldn't be there. But why ruin a good take by a single note that's out of tune, or out of time? Furthermore, Melodyne can pitch shift with great accuracy - by that I mean without artifacts.

During the production of our album (which still isn't finished!) we finished a song with some crazy improvising from the three horns. It sounds wicked and I've picked my personal favourite take for my part, but I wish I could change just a couple of notes which, to me, don't sound like they fit. The performance is good, with energy, life and a real spirit for what we were trying to achieve. But these notes... they'll probably haunt me for the rest of my life. We're not changing them.

[mugametal]

if u say kiss my ass really quickly it sounds like chirstmas. kis mm as.
merry kis mm as santa

[Adam]

Merry Christmas!