song in the works (would love some suggestions)

[Powerpop451]

Hello I am new here so hopefully I am complying with all the rules and really am looking for some helpful feedback.

So I am recording my band's second EP and the first with live drums so it's very challenging I must say. I only have access to 4 mic inputs to mic the drums so I have two condenser mics as over heads spaced apart one about 3 feet over the tom/crash and one about three feed over the floor tom and ride. the other two mics are an SM 57 just off center from the center of the snare and about an inch and and a half above the drum head. I have D112 inside the kick about half way and just off center from the beater.

On issue I am having is the snare mic is picking up way too much hi-hat so much so that I can't gate it out of the mix and So whenever I bring up the snare the hi-hat is right there with it which is a big issue.

Also I am recording in a rather small room and the drums overall are sounding very dead and boxy. SO I have had to resort to some much more drastic EQing than I would like to get them to sound remotely close to what I want in the mix.

Everything else in the song at this stage is all rough scratch tracks so those will sound pretty rough and bad and will be replaced, but I am just asking for some drum miking, EQ, mixing advice based on what you hear in this track. Mind you, the drums have been eq'd to get closer to what I am looking for but I want to try to not have to do as much eqing to achieve this goal.

Index of /mp3

It is the only file on the page. It is titled "Moon & Sun".

Thanks in advance for any and all replies.
Mark Strong

[Powerpop451]

Any takers? Or am I just too far gone for you guys to help with some advice on this song?

Mark

[YAZAM68]

no idea about the recording.... I'm new. But for me, the sound balancing is ok...maybe the hi-hat or crash sound eq. the bass drum? I can't hear the bass guitar.

nice song.

nice guitar sound and playing. Can I know what guitar and amp set up?

[Powerpop451]

Originally Posted by YAZAM68

no idea about the recording.... I'm new. But for me, the sound balancing is ok...maybe the hi-hat or crash sound eq. the bass drum? I can't hear the bass guitar.

nice song.

nice guitar sound and playing. Can I know what guitar and amp set up?

Thanks for the reply and the feedback. Actually there is no bass guitar yet. We are still tracking for the song and all the instrument tracks that are in this recording are scratch tracks.

Thanks on the guitar playing, I actually felt I played it quite sloppy because I was just laying down a scratch track. Anyway for the lead guitar fills I am using a jazzmaster going into a Line 6 delay pedal and then going direct.

The other guitar bit are also direct going through an SansAmp.

[Powerpop451]

Also, could someone tell me the best way to get feedback and suggestions on a mix here in this forum. So far I have only gotten one response. I am new here so any suggestions and help with forum procedures as well as suggestions with my mix would be greatly helpful.

Thanks so much,
Mark

[Jeff B]

the piano has a nice ambiance in the beginning. it reminds me of the song during the airport scene in the movie "Almost Famous" by Nancy Wilson(check out her songs on the Elizabethtown soundtrack). So that's the sound I have pictured in my head. The kick is too upfront and theres not enough definition in the kick and hat-is it just OH mics and a kick in? I assume thats a sampled piano, right? Try to copy some of that space/ambiance with your guitars and fill out the right side of the sound spectrum a bit. nice!

[lolzgreg]

With drums, drastic eq is usually the way to get "that sound" in most cases. Usually a hell of a lot of eq is done, especially to the kick. I suggest that you try to use a lg diapraghm condenser about 3 feet or 4 feet in front of the drum kit. It will get you a nice powerful room sound that will bring some life to that kit of yours. Guitars sound nice. It's hard to judge a mix without bass. The singing and performance is very nice. Piano sound is wonderful. Remix it with bass and post it!

-Greg

[Powerpop451]

Originally Posted by Jeff B

the piano has a nice ambiance in the beginning. it reminds me of the song during the airport scene in the movie "Almost Famous" by Nancy Wilson(check out her songs on the Elizabethtown soundtrack). So that's the sound I have pictured in my head. The kick is too upfront and theres not enough definition in the kick and hat-is it just OH mics and a kick in? I assume thats a sampled piano, right? Try to copy some of that space/ambiance with your guitars and fill out the right side of the sound spectrum a bit. nice!

Yeah I love Almost Famous I don't recall the song you are speaking of right off the top of my head but I will take it as a compliment I suppose. haha

Yeah, I agree the kick is upfront a bit much and it could use more definition I souppose I will tweak the EQ a bit more until I find the right spots to give it definition, suggestions anyone? I am not sure I am understanding what you are asking in the second part. You write: "in the kick and hat-is it just OH mics and a kick in?" So I am guessing you are asking if the hi-hat is just overheads. Well I stated in the initial post my exact setup. which is a 4 mic setup. A D 112 inside the kick, 2 condensers as OH's and an SM 57 on the top of the snare about an inch and a half off the top head and just off center from the center of the drum. If that is not what you were asking could you please ask again.

The piano is actually not sampled. It is real, It's an upright that I recorded with two condenser mics in a church, there is no added reverb so what you hear is the natural room sound from the two mics. I suppose I could use a reverb though to emulate that space for the guitars like you suggest.

Thanks for the tips I will try to fix those issues and repost.

[Powerpop451]

Originally Posted by lolgreg

With drums, drastic eq is usually the way to get "that sound" in most cases. Usually a hell of a lot of eq is done, especially to the kick. I suggest that you try to use a lg diapraghm condenser about 3 feet or 4 feet in front of the drum kit. It will get you a nice powerful room sound that will bring some life to that kit of yours. Guitars sound nice. It's hard to judge a mix without bass. The singing and performance is very nice. Piano sound is wonderful. Remix it with bass and post it!

-Greg

Thanks Greg. Yeah I figured in this sort of set up I would have to use a lot of EQ on the kick and snare I was just hoping to find that sweet spot where it all works with very little EQ but I suppose that is left for the high end studios. So you are saying instead of placing the mic inside the kick I should place the kick mic about 3 to 4 feet in front? Is this with the front head on or off? Or did you meanb still have a kick mic and use another mic 3 to 4 feet off. I only have access to 4 mic inputs so 4 mics are all I have to work with here.

Thanks for the tip though and would love to hear more specifically which mic I should move in front of the drum, the kick mic or one of the overheads?

I will try these techniques and put a scratch bass in and repost.

[foundexodus]

Personally I think the mic placement is decent except the snare just because it picks up the hi hat so strongly, Try and put the mic as much off axis from the hi hat as possible. I think the kick drum has potential it's just a matter of finding the frequency to boost (I'd start around 4500Hz) I think just making sure the bass and the kick drum work together is the important thing, I would suggest tracking that and then reposting that way we can get a better idea as to what it needs. Nice work tho, very cool song.