Big Band Jazz : Margot's Mood (Mix Practice)

[fHumble fHingaz]

Here's an interesting piece that I found on the interweb... I've tried a quick mix to give it a bit of a vintage vibe - I'd be interested in your opinions.

Thanks,
fH fH

[bobbybovine]

Hey man. I am definitely no expert on jazz but what I have noticed in what I have heard is the instruments all take turns being the focus in the mix while the rest lay back, which is what you have done. I would say nice job.

[fHumble fHingaz]

I have noticed in what I have heard is the instruments all take turns being the focus in the mix while the rest lay back, which is what you have done. I would say nice job.

Thanks Bob, but I can't take credit for that - that is how the performance was arranged - with real old-school style arranging skills. My mix is completely static - absolutely no automation at all. As I said - it was quick mix.

[bobbybovine]

that is how the performance was arranged - with real old-school style arranging skills. My mix is completely static - absolutely no automation at all. As I said - it was quick mix.

Goes to show arrangement is KING!!!

[fHumble fHingaz]

... Oh, & the other thing about this track is that it is completely midi. There are no live instruments at all. All the sounds are provided by Garritan's Jazz & Big Band library, bar the drums, which are Superior Drummer 2.0. I downloaded the midi because I wanted to examine how the writer/arranger of the track managed to extract such a realistic performance... (I wonder how long it took him?)

It sounded so good that I couldn't resist doing a quick mix!

[LazyE]

jaz rules!
i dont listen to it often, but if you want to find proper musicians, go to a jaz club!


A rock guitarist plays 3 different chords to 30,000 people,
while a jaz guitarist plays 30,000 chords to 3 people

[bobbybovine]

We have the Jazz Festival here in Halifax every summer and I haven't gotten over to it in years, I have seen some amazing musicians and they are totally cool cats usually as well. I did notice that it was midi, however only some spots stuck out as being "not real" a lot of it was indistinguishable.

[fHumble fHingaz]

Yeah, I really admire jazz musos too - I have a few friends who are top-notch jazz players

i dont listen to it often, but if you want to find proper musicians, go to a jaz club!

I'm in the same boat.

A rock guitarist plays 3 different chords to 30,000 people,
while a jaz guitarist plays 30,000 chords to 3 people

Very true! Jazz doesn't have the wide appeal of pop or rock, but it is definitely best seen live.

We have the Jazz Festival here in Halifax every summer and I haven't gotten over to it in years, I have seen some amazing musicians and they are totally cool cats usually as well.

Because it is an "enthusiasts" genre, most of the musos are very humble, yet extremely accomplished.

I did notice that it was midi, however only some spots stuck out as being "not real" a lot of it was indistinguishable.

Good to know... I've heard quite a few of these midi-fied jazz pieces, but this one really stuck out to me for it's realism.

[garageband]

(fHfH is a good dude, he'll understand...)

I didn't like it much. Here's why. The snare up front put me off from the get-go. It's a rock snare sound and is not a drum you'd be using with brushes or playing lots of ghost notes on. How many musicians are you trying to emulate? 8? 20? I have no feel for the band as an entity. It sounds like a buncha instruments run together. The chords in the tbns on the outro should be on the and of 3, not 4. Bari is all pokin' out everywhere. Nice bass tbn sample. But that's the problem - I can hear all the samples too clearly. It just doesn't sound real at all, the way it's mixed it doesn't sound like a group of musicians playing music on acoustic instruments in a room somewhere. That's way move important to the (wait for it) oeuvre than how "realist" the sounds or articulations are. I also think it'd swing better if you shaved a little off the tempo.

Like at :19, things are bumpin' along. You got your brass figures and then each entrance of that cascade is hugely out-of-proportion, tdiminishing believability. The short Bari/Tbn1 duet at :42 ( two notes on review) or so is cool but sounds wrong. That bari is poking out again. It's a hair bright. If you get a five or six feet from a bari, it really doesn't have that kind of projected brightness. Woodwinds aren't particularly directional. Sure, if you shove a mic down the bell, the sound gets all brassy and reedy but nobody hears one on a bandstand that way. Same goes for the cup muted tpt up front. At a normal distance, a cup-muted tpt is dark and muffled and, well, muted. That high clack from tonguing is something the player and the guy on either side can hear but it really becomes not prominent with just a little distance. Keep in mind the cup is directing the sound back toward the player.

Just stuff like that. I could go on. It's a "no" from me. No offense.

[fHumble fHingaz]

Wow! Thanks for the comprehensive critique GB... love the "no offense" at the end - Why do I always get a creeping, deep sense of irony when people say that? Need I reply "none taken"?... I guess not - nevertheless, the unvarnished truth does tend to hurt just a bit...

The snare up front put me off from the get-go. It's a rock snare sound and is not a drum you'd be using with brushes or playing lots of ghost notes on.

I definitely agree. This is one of the main things that bothered me after I bounced the mix. However, the intended drumset the composer used was not actually a brush kit - I tried one, & it just didn't fit...

the way it's mixed it doesn't sound like a group of musicians playing music on acoustic instruments in a room somewhere. That's way move important to the (wait for it) oeuvre than how "realist" the sounds or articulations are. I also think it'd swing better if you shaved a little off the tempo.

Again, I agree - I spent virtually zero time mixing - just basically a rough fader balance, tweaking some reverb parameters within JABB to try to give some sense of dimension & depth. I did virtually no individual eq. (excepting the bass).

I referenced some bigger band Miles Davis stuff, but comparing some rockier tunes from the Brian Setzer Orchestra, I decided to go for a drier, more up front sound... perhaps that was a mistake.

...anyhoo, seems like another epic fail on my part - nevermind, perhaps I'm over-stretching myself taking on a genre I'm clearly not au fait with. Anyway, I enjoyed myself - & it interests me, so I shall probably inflict more upon you all at some stage in the future.

Thanks again!

[kakeux]

not au fait with

you does speak french

There is one tone that I founded out of the mix...the right trumpets....or kind of trumpets...

I have to admit, I was not thinking midi at all...I listened to it while reading other post....now I know, so maybe a second listen will reveal the midi origin...

[fHumble fHingaz]

Thanks k.

There is one tone that I founded out of the mix...the right trumpets....or kind of trumpets...

You're right - I put too much "depth" on them - they sound too far away compared to the rest of the instruments.

[garageband]

You're right - I put too much "depth" on them - they sound too far away compared to the rest of the instruments.

Actually, that was the bit I thought you had right. If you got everyone back there, it'll sound radically more life-like.